Campeonato de los Andes 2023

[Gipfelstuermer]

Never too early to think about it. A great Andes design needs time. Of course I would like to do it myself, but you are lucky, I don't have enough time

Lenny, Hansa, since you did it last year, are you motivated to design it again this year ? Or does someone else want to take the opportunity?

Also, this year, we would have the special opportunity to introduce custom jerseys for the Andes! Someone creative wants to design them? Of course the design should somehow take into account the race history, I think 15 years since Cerro Torre RT invented this great race. And the design needs to be great so that we keep it for at least 15 years

[Hansa]

So i talked to Lenny and we could imagine doing it again.

But if someone else wants to do it please tell us soon

[Schnuggeritos]

I would like to take over the part of route planning / guidance for this year. I already did some planning and created a few routes (more scetches than a final version) across all parts.

For the first scetches I used Komoot but i'm not 100% sure if the surfaces are all correct.

[Schnuggeritos]

I talked to Hansa and Lenny in the morning and we decided that I will design Andes 2023 according to the 'rules' below. I will stay in touch with both to design those stages as realistic as possible.

As soon as there is anything to report about you will read about it in this thread.

Most important tip: Keep the spirit of the founder of the Campeonato Cerro Torre RT: Extreme long and difficult climber tour with special highlights.

Extreme long and difficult climber tour
A) Usually min. 50% of the stages are classified "Mountain/HC" for good reason.
B) Usually there are some stages with up to ~250km.
C) Best rider type should have High Mountain & High Reg

Special Highlights (be creative!)
Can be
A) Dirt road climbs (like Camino de la Muerte)
B) Long TTT or ITT with special features (e.g. Mountain ITT or Dirt road ITT like on Salar de Uyuni)
C) pavè (like in the City of Valparaiso)
D) Super long climbs (like Cristo Redentor de los Andes)
E) Exciting stories (like visiting the home house of Nairo Quintana)
F) Exciting locations (like Galapagos Islands)
G) Some other cool ideas. Be creative!
But don't exaggerate. Not every stage can be a special highlights for 14/15 stages.

In addition, some facts:
- Normally a 16 days tour (incl. 1 or 2 rest days)
- It is fantasy but all roads should be real.
- Travel should be realistic if possible (so not too many flying all around South America)
- It's nice if you can present a map in addition to the profiles (In general, a nice presentation will be welcomed)

How I defined KOM and IS
Mountains:
HC-Cat.: 2000hm >=Ø6% OR 2500hm
1-Cat.: 1500hm >=Ø6% OR 2000hm
2-Cat.: 1000hm >=Ø6% OR 1500hm
3-Cat.: 500hm >=Ø6% OR 1000hm
4-Cat.: 250hm >=Ø6% OR 500hm

Sprints:
3 IS on Flat stages
2 IS on Hilly stages
1 IS on HC stages

Andes Design Tips:
- South America has bad roads
- Google Street View can give an impression for city areas
- Satellite Images (Google Maps) can help if no Street View is available
- Check road surface already while planning the route, to avoid bad surprises when doing the details
- GPS-Data for climbs is often imprecise, so should be researched and corrected if possible (A passage +6 -3 +7 can in reality be +3 +3 +4)
- Try to finish and present before October 31, for form settings

General Design Tips applicable to Andes, too
- RideWithGPS for building the route
- Having other websites for route building can help, too (some areas are better in other tools)
- Google Maps Satellite and Street View for checking road surface
- "Recalculate elevation" to make sure, the total height is correct
- No Downhill Pavè steeper than -2 (can cause bugs)
- No Pavè and KOM/IS on same Kilometer (can cause bugs)
- Race Name and City Name only use letters A-Z (special letters can cause bugs)

Some recent things from my last designs
- Be prepared for toxic players, who blame you for the race, no matter how good or bad you designed the race.
- You may want to leave December Tour contest to other designers this year. One year, I designed Andes and then I won the Dec Tour contest in the same year. Still feel bad about it.
- Something for smaller non-mountain teams can be good for participation. So some escape stages, sprint stages or hill sprint stages. But you can't have all of that... it's never going to be a balanced tour.
- Have fun designing! It's a lot of research, but you can get a really unique route in the end.

Anything I forgot? Just ask

[Gipfelstuermer]

I talked to Hansa and Lenny in the morning and we decided that I will design Andes 2023 according to the 'rules' below. I will stay in touch with both to design those stages as realistic as possible.

Nice, have fun! Excited to see your route in a few weeks

[Robyklebt]

These are not rules, this is advice. That, apart from the whining it includes, is just the opinion of one player, and it really has not more value than any other opinion.

[Hansa]

These are not rules, this is advice. That, apart from the whining it includes, is just the opinion of one player, and it really has not more value than any other opinion.

i guess thats why he put rules in " ' ' ". and Lenny and me used the same catgorization last year. Obviously Schnugge doesnt have to use them too.

[Hansa]

Also, this year, we would have the special opportunity to introduce custom jerseys for the Andes! Someone creative wants to design them? Of course the design should somehow take into account the race history, I think 15 years since Cerro Torre RT invented this great race. And the design needs to be great so that we keep it for at least 15 years

How would that work to design a jersey?

[Gipfelstuermer]

How would that work to design a jersey?

We would need a jersey icon & jersey for each classification (GC, Points, Mountain, Youth).

For the icon use this template: https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Jersey_white.svg

For the jersey use this template:
http://cycling4freaks.com/c4f-2.0/c4f-r ... 658747.png

[team fl]

How would that work to design a jersey?

We would need a jersey icon & jersey for each classification (GC, Points, Mountain, Youth).

For the icon use this template: https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Jersey_white.svg

For the jersey use this template:
http://cycling4freaks.com/c4f-2.0/c4f-r ... 658747.png

This might be a job for Takashi Murakami... But I fear he's too busy (=indifferent). Anyway, I try to contact him, maybe he comes up with some drafts until the end of August...

Anyway, another thing about the "rules". Forget the December tour stuff! If you have a great idea for a December tour too, do it. We need good designs to vote for. No need to feel guilty...

[Gipfelstuermer]

Anyway, another thing about the "rules". Forget the December tour stuff! If you have a great idea for a December tour too, do it. We need good designs to vote for. No need to feel guilty...

yes, if anyone comes here and thinks "oh, I would have liked to design Andes, too." , feel free to start with a December Tour design

Official contest starts in September normally.

Speaking of that, there can be custom jerseys for the December Tour, too But not sure how to best handle that. Introduce one jersey for all December Tours ? Or have a different one every year ? Same question for the race history somehow. Should it dispay nothing (because each Dec Tour is Individual) or should the Dec Tour History have all the history (because all Dec Tours belongs together). Answer for race history and jersey should be the same then... but noticing I'm getting a bit off topic here... so can be discussed in September in the Dec Tour thread then.

And good reminder we should improve the Race Editor before the contest starts

[team fl]

First tries for jerseys, open for modification proposals:

[team fl]

Short comments about the design that Takashi Murakami sent me:

- GC jersey has the most common colours of country flags in it that happen to be part of the Andes and the Argentinian sun on the chest. Fitting for a GC leader, who is on the sunny side, closest to the sun first (usually) on top of the mountains etc. (insert your favourite analogy) . The "rainbow" represents the Whipala. The Wiphala is a square emblem commonly used as a flag to represent some native peoples of the Andes that include today's Peru, Bolivia, Chile, Ecuador, northwestern Argentina and southern Colombia.

The colours represent the following:

Red: The Earth and the Andean man
Orange: Society and culture
Yellow: Energy and strength
White: Time and change
Green: Natural resources and wealth
Blue: The Cosmos
Violet: Andean government and self-determination

- Points jersey is inspired by the flag of the municipality of Andes (Antioquia, Colombia)

- Mountain classement is inspired by the football club CA Los Andes (Buenos Aires, Argentina) and their jerseys.

- Youth jersey is inspried by the Argentinian und Urugayan light blue, as light colours represent the "lightness" of the youth

[team fl]

Here the youth jersey. Didn't work before somehow.

[Gipfelstuermer]

- GC jersey has the most common colours of country flags in it that happen to be part of the Andes and the Argentinian sun on the chest. Fitting for a GC leader, who is on the sunny side, closest to the sun first (usually) on top of the mountains etc. (insert your favourite analogy) . The "rainbow" represents the Whipala. The Wiphala is a square emblem commonly used as a flag to represent some native peoples of the Andes that include today's Peru, Bolivia, Chile, Ecuador, northwestern Argentina and southern Colombia.

Awesome

First I thought rainbow is tricky because of the World Championship jersey but it looks completely different from that and I love how it fits to the colors of the south american flags, so it's genius.

So just one question to Mr. Murakami: Why do they all wear white arm warmers? Expected short sleeve jerseys (summer in the southern hemisphere) or long sleeve jerseys (high altitude) or black arm warmers (standard color), but who really wears white arm warmers?

[cataracs]

So just one question to Mr. Murakami: Why do they all wear white arm warmers? Expected short sleeve jerseys (summer in the southern hemisphere) or long sleeve jerseys (high altitude) or black arm warmers (standard color), but who really wears white arm warmers?

I agree with this. And the white part in the GC leader jersey (background of the sun) also doesn't look too good, I think some color would look better.

But great job Takashi, the jerseys fit the theme.

[schappy]

Speaking of that, there can be custom jerseys for the December Tour, too But not sure how to best handle that. Introduce one jersey for all December Tours ? Or have a different one every year ? Same question for the race history somehow. Should it dispay nothing (because each Dec Tour is Individual) or should the Dec Tour History have all the history (because all Dec Tours belongs together). Answer for race history and jersey should be the same then... but noticing I'm getting a bit off topic here... so can be discussed in September in the Dec Tour thread then.

Of course, have a History, its not everytime the same, like TdF (Pave or not, much TT or not...) is not everytime the Same, but is the same Race for me. And then it have to be the same special jersey everyyear, some spectacular stuff.

The Andes Jersey looks really nice, but Taka is right, white is not the best for this type of jersey here.

[team fl]

Thanks for the inputs. Here the collected improvement points

- the arm sleeves should be black or in the colour of the jersey.
- the GC jersey should not be white in front (background of the sun).

For the second point, I have some thougths: green is out (points), red is out (mountain) and light blue is out (youth). Black looks weird too. So we could just make it yellow to represent the sun and leave the sun out completely. I would change the yellow stripe on the rainbow to white then.

[team fl]

draft 2, GC jersey:

[team fl]

And the rest of the plain jerseys:

[flockmastoR]

Speaking of that, there can be custom jerseys for the December Tour, too But not sure how to best handle that. Introduce one jersey for all December Tours ? Or have a different one every year ? Same question for the race history somehow. Should it dispay nothing (because each Dec Tour is Individual) or should the Dec Tour History have all the history (because all Dec Tours belongs together). Answer for race history and jersey should be the same then... but noticing I'm getting a bit off topic here... so can be discussed in September in the Dec Tour thread then.

Of course, have a History, its not everytime the same, like TdF (Pave or not, much TT or not...) is not everytime the Same, but is the same Race for me. And then it have to be the same special jersey everyyear, some spectacular stuff.

The Andes Jersey looks really nice, but Taka is right, white is not the best for this type of jersey here.

+

December Tour is December Tour, I want the history to be displayed. About jerseys for December Tour I think the normal yellow, green, etc is fine.

The Andes jerseys are really nice! Good work

[team fl]

for comparision, the GC jersey with the white belly and the sun:

[Tukhtahuaev]

I don't really see the issue with the white belly for the leader's jersey. With the darker background of the race screen I would expect it to look a lot better than here

[Robyklebt]

What Tukh said! Me likes!

[Hansa]

for comparision, the GC jersey with the white belly and the sun:

i really like that more than the other one and i think white belly should be fine