Classiques Belges

[Robyklebt]

Het Nieuwsblad



Pavé and Bergs....

In the order of the race

30 Molenberg 4**
38 Berendries 7
41 Elverenberg 4
43 Bonte *
46 Toepkapel 5 (new, not sure we had it before, 4 might be better?)
50 Valkenberg 6 (5 last 2 years, 6 seems better to me)
62 Eikenberg 6**
70 Katteberg 5* (up from 4)
71-72 Holleweg 2** 1*
75 Varent 6
80-81 Haaghoek -1*** 1***
82 Leberg 5 (no km break between Haaghoek and Leberg)
88 Gerardsbergstestraat in Brakel, parallel to Tenbosse, 3 but could be more... Ten Bosse used to be 6 at times, that seems too much to me, 450m a 6,9%, 28 meters up, probably 4 or 5 better. Same for this one here? But not changing now,
92 unnamed climb to Everbeek Boven 5
102 La Houppe 2 5 4
108 Kanarieberg 8
112 Taaienberg 6**

Then it's the some of the same ones again,

162 Parikeberg 5
177 Mur 8****
181 Bosberg 6**
186 Congoberg 5 (new never ridden at c4f maybe?) from this side no pavé, an other side, north, would be with

No guarantee I got all, the pavé isn't mentioned in the link from Bear, hope I didn't miss any.

[Bear]

Looks good. For sure I cant design it better and I dont have any more information about pavé sections. Congoberg seems to be correct. No pavé (checked it on google streetview).

[Robyklebt]

Kuurne-Bruxelles-Kuurne



Tiegemberg 5
Volkegemberg 5
Holleweg 1**
Bontestraat 1*
Boembeek 5
Gieterijstraat 0*
Bossenaarstraat 5
Mont Saint-Laurant (also called Cote de les Hauts) 8** up from 7**. Pavé seems only 450 meters, but at times could almost be a ***
La Houppe 2 5 4
Kanarieberg 8
Kruisberg 6**
Hotond 4
Knokteberg 8
Oude Kwaremont 6*** 3***
Kluisberg 6
Beerbosstraat 3* (it's only 400 meters, and to me looks like a **, so due to the shortness=*)

No time for complaints, on now (ok, good complaints and can replace it...)

[Robyklebt]

Harelbeke

Mostly the same as in the past



29 Katteberg 5*
30-31 Holleweg 2** 1*
43-44 Paddestraat 2** 1**
88-90 La Houppe 2 5 4
95 Kanarieberg 8
102 Kruisberg 6**
111 Knokteberg 8
121 Kortekeer 7 (6,4% 1000 meter according to Wikipedia, but since we "overdo" many of the 500-800 long ones, here up to 7 seems better to me
126 Taaienberg 6**
134 Berg ten Stene 6
139 Boigneberg 5
144 Eikenberg
149-150 Mariaborrestraat 2*** -2***
160 Kapelberg 5
163 Paterberg 7**
167-168 Oude Kwaremont 6*** 3***
175 Karnemelkbeekstraat 6
182-183 Varent 0* 1*
186 Tiegemberg 5

[Pokemon Club]

A circuit this year for Amstel



Geulhemmerberg 6
Geulhemmerberg 4
Cauberg 6

Mintact km 188, maybe a bit early ?

[Robyklebt]

Het Volk done. Mostly copied the hellingen and kasseien from last year. Some I couldn't find, some seem to regularly change, Wolvenberg, 6 seems ok.



44-45 Haaghoek -1*** 1***
46 Leberg 5
68-69 Huisepontweg 0** 0**
104 Katteberg 5*
105-106 Holleweg 2** 1*
111-112 Haaghoek -1*** 1***
113 Leberg 5
121-122 Paddestraat 2** 1**
138 Valkenberg 6
147 Holleweg - 1* (other way around and only half compared to first passage)
149 Wolvenberg 6
154 Kerkgate 1 **
156 Jagerij 0 **
164 Marlboroughstraat 4
166 Biesestraat 3
167-168 Haaghoek -1*** 1***
169 Leberg 5
173 Berendries 7
175 Elverenberg/Vossehof 4
187 Mur 8****
191 Bosberg 6**

[Robyklebt]

Kuurne-Bruxelles-Kuurne



16 Tiegemberg 5
35 Katteberg 5*
36-37 Holleweg 2** 1*
55 Boembeek 5
74 Bossenaarstraat 5
77 Berg ten Houte 6** (up from 6* years ago, seems to me ** is ok here, length too 1,1km pavé, if info correct)
85 La Houppe/Hoppeberg 6 2 (used to be 2 5 4, but only doing 1,7 km, the first 400 Meter are at basically 0.5%, then a km at 6-7%, then almost flat again. So a 6 now, could even be 7 maybe) 2 at the end to get the height.
102 Hameau des Papins 7
111 Le Bourliquet
116 Mont Saint-Laurant 8**
125 Kruisberg 6**
126 Hotond 4
134 Knokteberg/Trieu 8
141 Kluisberg 6
160 Beerbosstraat 3*

[Robyklebt]

From Nokere Koerse:

Wolvenberg 6%
Hollestraat-Karel Martelstraat combination 2**0**-2* 2400 meters
Huisepontweg 1900 meters followed by Hoevenstraat 300 meters 0** 0** 0* like last year. Here maybe 2 km better.

[Robyklebt]

Same parcours as 2021. Adapted only La Houppe, see below


29 Katteberg 5*
30-31 Holleweg 2** 1*
43-44 Paddestraat 2** 1**
88-90 La Houppe 2 4 6 (unlike KBK from the bottom, so a 2 first. then goes up further, 150 meter vs 130 for KBK. 4 6 or 6 4... both possible, here 4 6 seemed better.
95 Kanarieberg 8
102 Kruisberg 6**
111 Knokteberg 8
121 Kortekeer 7
126 Taaienberg 6**
134 Berg ten Stene 6
139 Boigneberg 5
144 Eikenberg 6**
149-150 Mariaborrestraat 2*** -2***
160 Kapelberg 5
163 Paterberg 7**
167-168 Oude Kwaremont 6*** 3***
175 Karnemelkbeekstraat 6
182-183 Varent 0* 1*
186 Tiegemberg 5

[Robyklebt]

Dwars Door Vlaanderen



61-62 Nieuwe Kwaremont 5 5
80 Knoktebert/Trieu 8
93 Hotond 4
100 Korteker 7
104 Mariaborrestraat 2***
113 Berg Ten Houte 6**
119 Kanarieberg 8
132 Knokteberg 8
136 Hotond 4
143 Mariaborrestraat 2***
146 Ladeuze 6
156 Doorn 0* (only 600 meters, full Doorn would be **)
162 Nokereberg 2*
173 Herlegemstraat 0*
175 Holstraat 4

[Robyklebt]

Gent-Wevelgem, the shittiest most annoying race to design, ever....

We seem to have had a rather outdated version, same since 2018, despite small changes almost every year. Plus no info here either, by anybody, at least not anything useful. I




112 Veurnestraat 0* no check, don't care enough
153 Scherpenberg 2
157 Schominkelstraat-Banenberg 6
163 Monteberg 6 (taken from Handzame in past years)
165 Kemmelberg (Belvedere) basically from the southeast, standard route) 8*** (see above)
178-179 Hill 63 2* 1*
181 Christmas Truce 0*
183 The Catacombs 1* Pavé (dirt?)copied from Poke,
195 Monteberg 6
197 Kemmelberg (Belvedère) 8***
210 Schominkelstraat-Banenberg 6
215 Kemmelberg (Ossuaire) From the West, what used to be the pavé downhill until there was a crash years ago. 10 ** (800 meters at 10%, but only 200 on pavé).

Mintact at 210

Have to say didn't piss me off nearly as much as it used too.... no guarantee for precision.
Corrections not welcome on this one, if I design it, then it's designed and everybody who had their chance to go for it but didn't has no more say in it.

[Robyklebt]

Ronde done, online soon.



105 Lippenhoverstraat ** (could be * too I think looking at google street)
106-107 Paddestraat ** ** cut the km nonpavé we had, it's 100 meters or so, basically together
136-137 Oude Kwaremont 6*** 3***
147 Korteker 7
154 Achterberg 5
157 Holleweg 0**
159 Wolvenberg 6
163 Kerkgate 3**
166 Jagerij 0*
171 Molenberg 4**
174-175 Marlboroughstraat 4 2
179 Berendries 7
184 Valkenberg 6
197 Berg Ten Houte 6 **
202 Kanarieberg 8
217-218 Oude Kwaremont 6*** 3***
222 Paterberg 7**
229 Koppenberg 7****
232-233 Mariaborrestraat STationsberg 3*** -2***
236 Taaienberg 6**
244-245 Kruisberg 3 6* -
255-256 Oude Kwaremont 6*** 3***
260 Paterberg 7**

Kept the mintact where Gaurain put it, before the second Oude Kwaremont, so 216

Some weird stuff in the Koppenberg-Mariaborre-Taaienberg thing, according to La Flamme Rouge it's 8km from the top of the Koppenberg to the top of the Taaienberg, but I come to 6km or so... ? No it's 7. No time to check on the official site, note for next year

[Gipfelstuermer]

Brabantse Pijl

Moskesstraat and Herstraat could be ** instead of * in my point of view. There were some decisive moves there in the real race today but of course nothing in RSF with * only.

Just for next year, it could be an idea.

[Robyklebt]

Het Nieuwsblad

Lange Munte and Molenberg back in, other stuff out. No changes in hills/pavé

Haaghoek -1*** 1***
Leberg 5
Lange Munte 1*0**0**
Katteberg 5*
Holleweg 2** 1*
Haaghoek -1*** 1***
Leberg 5
Paddestraat 2** 1**
Valkenberg 6
Holleweg - 1* (other way around and only half compared to first passage)
Wolvenberg 6
Kerkgate 2 **
Jagerij 0 **
Molenberg 4**
Haaghoek -1*** 1***
Leberg 5
Berendries 7
Elverenberg/Vossehof 4
Mur 8****
Bosberg 6**

[Robyklebt]

From Bredene

Kemmelberg from Kemmel: 3 8***

Kemmelberg: Beukelaarstraat, Lettingstraat, Kemmelbergweg... so same last km or so as the Monteberg version, so 8***, but the first 800 meter really are at 6% too, so difficult, 4 8*** so overdesigned by 20 meters, now 10 meters higher than the first one, but....

[Robyklebt]

Kemmelberg from the West, 10** not fully convinced, seems last year I go a reading 800 meters 10%, this year nowhere close to that but since I might have done more advanced stuff last year than this year will keep it. ** IMO here ok since it's only 200 meters of pavé. At least that's what I wrote last year.

So, boys and girls, never forget to write down your reading here in this thread!

[Robyklebt]

51-52 Varent -1* 0*
67 Volkegemberg 5
68 Holleweg (700m) 1 **
83 Hotond (east) 5
91 Knoktebert/Trieu 8
98 Korteker 7
101 Mariaborrestraat 2***
112 Berg Ten Houte 6**
118 Kanarieberg 8
131 Knokteberg 8
134 Hotond (west)4
142 Mariaborrestraat 2***
146 Ladeuze 6
155 Doorn 0*** (900 meters)
158-159 Huisepointweg 0** 0**
162 Nokereberg 2*
166 Herlegemstraat 0**
178 Herlegemstraat 0**
175 Holstraat 4

The flat pavé parts could be checked by somebody else if somebody feels like it....
Mariaborre is pretty wide, so maybe ** enough? But length, 1.1 km, and been like this a while, so left it.
Doorn narrow and to me seemed as bad as Mariaborre, so went for ***
Huisepointweg narrow like Doorn, but to me looked easier, so kept it at ** as it has been for a while
Herlegemstraat was * last year, la flamme rouge says 1100 meters, but it's less, first 700 meters and then a bit under 200 meters. First part * or **. Second part starts what looks like a ***, but then finishes like *...? So ** seemed ok.

[Gipfelstuermer]

DDV seems reasonable for me.

Huisepontweg and Mariaborrestraat both on the edge, can argue for ** or ***, but makes sense to keep it consistent unless there's a strong case to change it.

[Gipfelstuermer]

RVV

New start in Bruges, so different 137km run up to the Oude Kwaremont with Huisepontweg and Korte Ast in that.

Then Eikenberg instead of Achterberg.

Huisepontweg **
Korte Ast *
Eikenberg **



Mintact: Km218

[Robyklebt]

Brabantse Pijl

Moskesstraat and Herstraat could be ** instead of * in my point of view. There were some decisive moves there in the real race today but of course nothing in RSF with * only.

Just for next year, it could be an idea.

Reviewing those 2 thingies...

Moskestraat for sure has to be steeper. Depending on the source it's 7,98% (dutch Wikipedia) to 9,8% (climbbybike) for 550 or so meters, so goes up 47/49/50 something like that meters. Absolute minimum a 5%.
pavé is 300 meters, to me looks like a **, like Eikenberg, actually maybe more of a ** than Eikenberg, but Eikenberg is over a km long (with a short break in the middle, and 2 asphalt bands that I don't know if they are closed during the race. Similar to Taaienberg as well, but again, that is longer.

Went for 5** finally, thinking is not to change it too much, but think 6** would be ok too.. 5* actually too.

Hertstraat, pavé IMO clear *, 300 meters again. The climb.... depending on the site again it's between 24 and 36 meters over 700 meters (probably shorter in some places, closed all those tabs now), IMO here a 3 could actually work too, but since I keep Moske at 5 and not go to 6+, leaving this at 4* seems reasonable.

Mintact 172
Can still all be discussed, it's in review, not in planned calendar yet.

[Gipfelstuermer]

67 Volkegemberg 5
68 Holleweg (700m) 1 **

Any strong view on Holleweg? Did you change the assessment of it between KBK 2023 and DDV 2023?

Because in KBK 2023 you had Holleweg as 1* and then in DDV as 1**. Both can be argued for, I guess, as it's only 700m.

Because for KBK 2024 I used your KBK 2023 assessment, but can also make it **. No problem for me.

[Robyklebt]

Aaaaaaaaaaaahhhh

Shouldn't have written anything... Now will have to check?

Remember that maybe Holleweg was one where it's different lengths, depending on from where to where exactly, different +/- maybe too, depending what side.... Yep, written in this thread too.

So the KBK-DDV is either that difference or a mistake, both possible.

Hm, looking at the profile 23 online now looks Holleweg 2** 1* after the Katteberg last year. So longer Holleweg, that's why **/*. 1500 meters? I read somewhere or dreamt it, can't find it anymore. Volkegemberg-Holleweg seems to have been 1** for the Holleweg rather consistently?

So: 1500 meters (seems correct, google map measurement gives that too), rating ** but since it's 1,5km, the second 500 meters downgraded to *
700 meters: Not a full km, but close enough, so **
Seems to be the thinking last year.

So I would say go for 1** (to me that's what was there indirectly 23 too), but going for 1* is fine too, everything can be changed, nothing is fix or perfect or even good, look at the pavé, which to me in places looks like a clear **, in others more a *

Anyway, change away, keep the same, IMO the important thing is to document it like I tried to in the past, so that future designers or north designers this year have something to go on. Which, I repeat, doesn't mean they shouldn't change stuff they disagree with.

[Gipfelstuermer]

700 meters: Not a full km, but close enough, so **

Ok, thanks for checking and sounds reasonable, so Iwill use ** then.

[Gipfelstuermer]

New run-in, with recent ratings:

Katteberg 5* 2*
Holleweg 1**
Martelstraat 0** -2**
Jagerij 1**
Varent 0*
Varentstraat 1* 1*
Hellestraat 5
Petegemberg 4
Fabriekstraat 3

Slightly changed lap, with recent ratings:

Nokereberg 2*
Herlegemstraat 0**
Lange Ast 2*
Doorn 0***
Huisepontweg 2** 0** 0*

[Gipfelstuermer]

Start in Antwerp, which added
Lippenhovestraat 1**
Paddestraat 2** 1**

Then, Kapelleberg 6 (instead of Eikenberg before Holleweg)

Later, Nieuwe Kruisberg/Hotond 6 -1 2 (instead of Kanariebeerg before the second Kwaremont)

Rest the same, in total 3km shorter.