Nationenkomitee / Nations Committee

[Alster]

Wie kannst du es wagen Duncan Urquhart für deine lächerliche Argumentation heranzuziehen. Duncan ist kein Vorname, pff... Ich sage nur: "Es kann nur einen geben!", schau dir gefälligst Highlander an.

[team fl]

Z.b

Die fehlen aber nicht, weil es sie nicht gibt, sondern weil du die Regeln nur selektiv aufgeführt hast. Das ist dir schon bewusst?

[GoddelauerClub]

Ja sicher...
Komm ich will mich nicht mich da jetzt streiten oder so.
Hab auch überreagiert, es ging mir da nur um paar Beispiele.

Ich hätte meine Standpunkte sachlicher Darstellen müssen und dann mit euch drüber diskutieren.
Die Worte die gefallen sind tun mir Leid.

Vllt. Kann man das Thema nochmal sachlicher zu einem anderen Zeitpunkt fortfahren, denke da hab ich zuviel und zuschnell Öl ins Feuer gegossen...

Gruß,
Ralf

[olaf]

whats wrong with afkar Sorenson, you remove his Danish nationality. Sorensen, or Sorenson, is a surname that can be of Danish or Scandinavian origin. The basic derivation is "son of Søren", the Danish variety of the name Severin. The name almost exclusively comes from Danish or Norwegian emigrants named Sørensen who altered the spelling of their names when they moved to countries outside Scandinavia whose orthographies do not use the letter ø.
http://www.nordicnames.de/wiki/Afkar

[team fl]

whats wrong with afkar Sorenson, you remove his Danish nationality. Sorensen, or Sorenson, is a surname that can be of Danish or Scandinavian origin. The basic derivation is "son of Søren", the Danish variety of the name Severin. The name almost exclusively comes from Danish or Norwegian emigrants named Sørensen who altered the spelling of their names when they moved to countries outside Scandinavia whose orthographies do not use the letter ø.
http://www.nordicnames.de/wiki/Afkar

Do you have a serious source that backs that up what you write about Sorenson? Because according to our sources, it should be Sorensen for Denmark. Sorenson has only been found as a family name overseas in the US and Canada, as in Sweden it would be Sorensson, usually (or even Sorensen, but not Sorenson).

The first name wasn't the problem, by the way.

[olaf]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorensen does this help
I would have spelt the name with o and a line through it, but not got that letter on my keyboard

[team fl]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorensen does this help
I would have spelt the name with o and a line through it, but not got that letter on my keyboard

No, it doesn't, because your rider is called SorensOn and not SorensEn. Sorensen would be just fine, as I already wrote before. And as I wrote too, the Sorenson guys are all US Americans, Canadians or even Aussies (if you want to chose one of these three nationalities).

[olaf]

ok il set his nation as Australia, are my other riders names ok?

[team fl]

ok il set his nation as Australia, are my other riders names ok?

As far as I see yes, besides one exception: Migthy Gabby is an artist name (of Mr. Anthony Carter from Barbados) and according to the NC Guidelines, that's not allowed. So he will be stateless.

[olaf]

. ok that's fair enough on gabby as it is his stage name. also just wondering why you do not have the nationality for wales and Scotland? only british which to 90% of the world means English.cheers

[team fl]

. ok that's fair enough on gabby as it is his stage name. also just wondering why you do not have the nationality for wales and Scotland? only british which to 90% of the world means English.cheers

That you have to ask leso and Buhmann. But I guess it's because in real life, there is no scottish or welsh cycling national team, only a british, as far as I know. And furthermore, Wales and Scotland are no independant nations but part of the UK.

[olaf]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welsh_Cycling but I think it dosent compete internationaly apart from commonwealth games, shame as we have our own teams in every other sport apart from cycling it seems. one day we will be free from English oppression.

[katiki]

why have Corentin Beaufays not a Belgian nation? Corentin its a belgian name and beaufays to

[Wookie]

why have Corentin Beaufays not a Belgian nation? Corentin its a belgian name and beaufays to

Is it that difficult to give us a source for this name here instead of just asking? Would make it easier for all of us.

[Robyklebt]

Actually if the committee followed its own rules, he wouldn't have to give a source.

The rules, wherever they are, theoretically would be a good idea to have them posted somewhere easy to find, say "realistic" name is ok. Corentin Beaufays sounds realistic. No need to even google, even less to demand a source for the name.

Of course the committee isn't following its own rules anymore. For quite a while the demand has been: REAL EXISTING names. Ok, but then update the rules.

[Wookie]

The problem is that i for example can't know all the reason why the other members decided to make riders stateless. We can't discuss all names.
Instead of giving us a source he can also wait until the member which made his rider stateless writes him an explanation, but i don't know when this will happen. So to make this process faster he could give us other members a source.

[team fl]

The old story about "sounds realistic". also sounds very easy to comply with, but it isn't. The current case is a good example: Guy's name is Beaufays. Sound realistic? Well it's kind of a French/Flamish jibberish, should be okay then, shouldn't it? But hey, where do I tell from that something sounds realistic and something else doesn't? The question then is only, does it sound familiar with a certain connex to a nationality to a very certain person (the nc member who is dealing with it)! Anyway, in this case, the reason not to accept the name is the following:

Because we're hard working in the NC, I looked the name up with the help of a search engine. Okay you will say, you don't have to dear FL, the name sounds realistic, no? Well, maybe, but then again, Beaufays is a Belgian commune, and not a person's name -> https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaufays. I don't know much about geographic naming in Belgium (guess it is different for every 10 km you pass), but where I come from, people don't tend to have names of communes (so for example "Gamprin" or "Fallsau" or "InDerBretscha" doesn't sound realistic at all for a rider's name). Strikingly, I live in a country whose name derives from a family name .

To conclude, I made the rider stateless because he was given a last name that is the name of a Belgian commune. And I count find any source that told me that his also is a family name. Still, the questions is, if the "sounds realistic" rule should overrule my findings. Doesn't solve the problem that the question if something sounds realistic at all, will still tend to be hard sometimes. Esp. when you look it up and you better would not have done it...

[Robyklebt]

"Because we're hard working in the NC, I looked the name up with the help of a search engine.

You don't have to do that, dear FL, the name sounds realistic, no?

Okay you will say, you don't have to dear FL, the name sounds realistic, no?

Wow, you're good!

Well, maybe, but then again, Beaufays is a Belgian commune, and not a person's name -> https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaufays.

Well, no, as far as you know Beaufays isn't a Belgian commune. I guess you don't know much about geographic naming in Belgium, so before googling Beaufays is just a french sounding word. That either sounds realistic to you as a name, or not.

I don't know much about geographic naming in Belgium (guess it is different for every 10 km you pass), but where I come from, people don't tend to have names of communes (so for example "Gamprin" or "Fallsau" or "InDerBretscha" doesn't sound realistic at all for a rider's name). Strikingly, I live in a country whose name derives from a family name .

I'm good too!!! Ever heard of Alyssa Milano btw?

The point is "sounds realistic" will be decided before googling. And if it does, I expect it to pass. Of course "realistic" will mean something different for everybody, and maybe a name that sounds realistic sounds unrealistic after somebody tells you why he thinks it sound unrealistic. Or the opposite
So... .either just change the rules or actually work according to the rules, which are not only for committee members. They are for users too, they tell us what names we can use, without risking ending up without a nationality. Oh, my name is realistic, it will pass, Urs Tiefuli, Hochuli exists, Tiefuli then should be ok too. Then the committee strikes and you have a stateless superstar.
So: Either start following the rules the users that the users expect to be applied (user saying REALISTIC of course isn't automatically the winning argument...) or if you think having only real names is better, then just cut the realistic thing.
Of course "realistic" is difficult. Not really sure about Tiefuli either actually, on one hand I think it should pass, sounds logic, but on the other hand... bah... probably on the realistic argument I'd let it pass.. .right now, might be different in 5 minutes. What is "pure FL, not influenced by evil capitalistic google"'s opinion?
Anyway, as it stands now, Wookies reaction "post a source" is the wrong one. It should read "post a source or tell us why you think the name is realistic"

Ah, btw, http://research.google.com/pubs/author21120.html

Doesn't say the nationality, but the family name seems correct to me.

[Pokemon Club]

http://www.geneanet.org/genealogie/fr/beaufays.html

Anyway, Beaufays sounds way more french/belgian than Franko soounds ukranian, it isn't for that we ask you to out Franko's wikipedia.

[team fl]

And instead of starting a huge discussion here, that could have been done by the user easily. Would make live much easier for him and for us in the NC.

Comparing the number of cases, I think we're doing a fairly good job at the moment deciding about names. Unfortunatly, we also have such cases, where, due to an indivicual decision, it doesn't work as intended by the system. Well, that's what his thread is for. Doesn't cost anybody a lot to accept that.

Do I see it right, he has the Belgian nationality anyway?

[Pokemon Club]

And instead of starting a huge discussion here, that could have been done by the user easily. Would make live much easier for him and for us in the NC.

Comparing the number of cases, I think we're doing a fairly good job at the moment deciding about names. Unfortunatly, we also have such cases, where, due to an indivicual decision, it doesn't work as intended by the system. Well, that's what his thread is for. Doesn't cost anybody a lot to accept that.

The method of the NC is maybe the problem so. Well don't know how you work now, but instead of remove the name of a rider each time you have a doubt on it, PMs others members of NCs or the player who is concern before you act can make your and our lives easier too.

[team fl]

And instead of starting a huge discussion here, that could have been done by the user easily. Would make live much easier for him and for us in the NC.

Comparing the number of cases, I think we're doing a fairly good job at the moment deciding about names. Unfortunatly, we also have such cases, where, due to an indivicual decision, it doesn't work as intended by the system. Well, that's what his thread is for. Doesn't cost anybody a lot to accept that.

The method of the NC is maybe the problem so. Well don't know how you work now, but instead of remove the name of a rider each time you have a doubt on it, PMs others members of NCs or the player who is concern before you act can make your and our lives easier too.

The method works very well. It's not even 1% of the cases that end in such a thing. But as long as "sounds realistic" means a different thing to different persons, this rule will lead to further discussions in the future, I am sure of that. And it would open doors for arbitrariness. Because I can always say that it just didn't sound realistic to me (or the other way round). And I am not talking about French, Italian or German names only. Let's bring up Indonesian, Chinese, or Korean names. Or Vanuatu or whater... Do you know what sounds realistic there?

And due to the high number of cases, we don't have the time to back-check everything. That would make our work much more complicated than it is now. That's also a reason we need the help of the users in this thread sometimes.

[Pokemon Club]

The method works very well. It's not even 1% of the cases that end in such a thing. But as long as "sounds realistic" means a different thing to different persons, this rule will lead to further discussions in the future, I am sure of that. And it would open doors for arbitrariness. Because I can always say that it just didn't sound realistic to me (or the other way round). And I am not talking about French, Italian or German names only. Let's bring up Indonesian, Chinese, or Korean names. Or Vanuatu or whater... Do you know what sounds realistic there?

Yes I know (well except for Vanuatu), not very hard to make difference between asian countries names, and to know what is real or not.
Anyway, about what looks realistic you just complicate your life too much for nothing. It isn't because a name doesn't exist or is very rare that it doesn't looks unrealistic, if he fit the spirit of how are names in that country.
For exeample 2 olds french riders, Jaque Beauer and Killian NeigeDeSavoie, else if both name doesn't exist (I didn't verify, NeigeDeSavoie could really exist when Jaque Beauer is just a big joke.

[CircleCycle]

and poor stateless Lorenzo vonMatterhorn

[katiki]

Beaufays is a belgian name i know it a part of my family is beaufays