React Version - Statistics

[Robyklebt]

Just make both...Graph and text

[Schartner Bombe]

Alk and Gip, if you look at Cycling statistics maybe you get more inspiration for statistics there - only some inspired thoughts if thats possible:

- most attack kilometers
- active riders victory ranking
- debutant winners
- statistics per continent
- riders worn the yellow/red/green/white jersey in a GT ... days
- cyclocross rankings, in german "Querfeldeinrennen" (Herbst/Winter)
....

[Alkworld]

Alk and Gip, if you look at Cycling statistics maybe you get more inspiration for statistics there - only some inspired thoughts if thats possible:

- most attack kilometers
- active riders victory ranking
- debutant winners
- statistics per continent
- riders worn the yellow/red/green/white jersey in a GT ... days
- cyclocross rankings, in german "Querfeldeinrennen" (Herbst/Winter)
....

- most attack km --> no data available, what we have is the number of attacks, just not displayed yet
- active riders victory ranking --> don't we have that already? Just the normal rider stats?
- debutant winners --> winners in their first race? Not easy for the past years, but possible now
- statistics per continent --> based on rider nationality?
- riders worn the yellow/red/green/white jersey in a GT ... days --> data not available, could be extracted with race reports, but too much hassle, I guess
- cyclocross rankings, in german "Querfeldeinrennen" (Herbst/Winter) --> easy one, can be defined as race series, but only few races with few participants

[Schartner Bombe]

Alk and Gip, if you look at Cycling statistics maybe you get more inspiration for statistics there - only some inspired thoughts if thats possible:

- most attack kilometers
- active riders victory ranking
- debutant winners
- statistics per continent
- riders worn the yellow/red/green/white jersey in a GT ... days
- cyclocross rankings, in german "Querfeldeinrennen" (Herbst/Winter)
....

- most attack km --> no data available, what we have is the number of attacks, just not displayed yet
- active riders victory ranking --> don't we have that already? Just the normal rider stats?
- debutant winners --> winners in their first race? Not easy for the past years, but possible now
- statistics per continent --> based on rider nationality?
- riders worn the yellow/red/green/white jersey in a GT ... days --> data not available, could be extracted with race reports, but too much hassle, I guess
- cyclocross rankings, in german "Querfeldeinrennen" (Herbst/Winter) --> easy one, can be defined as race series, but only few races with few participants

thx for answer Alk.

- ok
- you are right - meant "most active rider" ranking in tours
- yes
- based on continent - europe, asia, ...
- ok
- your last answer gets me another inspired thought - a race series (Bike Infection or Gletschertrophy it was called) i was riding years ago was, "glocknerkönig (roadbike)" and "kitzsteinhorn (mountainbike)". maybe we get an rsf race series with the other paves races and some mountainbike races and combi with rsf roadraces.

[Robyklebt]

Back home, ready to dominate the forum again.

- Colors in the stat screens (and everywhere except races I think) are still this low contrast not very pleasing grey-white. Why not make it the same nice colors as in the race screen?
- Teams: Split it into 2 different tabs, there's a lot of new nice stuff there, and yes, filters there too, but IMO always bad when you can slide sideways, then the whole tab somehow becomes annoying. (and add races this month since you're at it, useful stuff even, not just for pleasure)
- Ex riders: Still takes ages to load, I propose going back to the old system... display just 100 (or 200) per page, instead of loading the whole 6300. But then show us all, not just 3000 points plus
- Split stats, race series, all nice and good but I would have thought stuff that was there before should have priority. But ok, it's there. so ideas to improve it:
a) numbers! Who's first etc. There in race series, not in split stuff
b) race series took me quite a while to load
c) Make the default absolute numbers, not weighted
d) Make all the riders and teams clickable, link it. (everywhere, there's that problem in other places too, team ex riders for example)
e) Race series some sideway sliding necessary again... Rather punish Chemnitz for his long team name and don't show the whole name but make that box or whatever it's called fix (or whatever that is called, anyway, no sliding (if that term is correct)
f) Riders sorting by family name, not by first name!

Then: Add the stuff that was there before!! Meaning: TRANSFERS! At least one team (Big Donkey) used that regularly!

And again about TEAM, since we don't have a separate thread for that (yet? better to make one?)

- Put in the riders directly after you first click on it. Nobody is interested to see only the general stats of his own team when he clicks there. LIke before, the general stats, below that the riders.
-Again the window/box whatever isn't wide enough... make sure everything fits, no "sliding" (still trying to figure out the correct word...) For example form column is wide because of 90.625-. First of all the - is wrong, second displaying the correct value is very nice, but maybe cut it off or write it smaller, the whole team thing should be visible at once.

Then IMO high priority stuff:

1) Default sorting back to family name!!!!!!!!!!
2) No sorting by first name
3) Placement!!!!! HOw am I to know where I ended up in March 2013 otherwise?

More another time.

[Gipfelstuermer]

Thanks for the suggestions.

I will try to focus on this part as I fully understand it and agree some optimization would be good:

- Teams: Split it into 2 different tabs, there's a lot of new nice stuff there, and yes, filters there too, but IMO always bad when you can slide sideways, then the whole tab somehow becomes annoying. (and add races this month since you're at it, useful stuff even, not just for pleasure)

And again about TEAM, since we don't have a separate thread for that (yet? better to make one?)

- Put in the riders directly after you first click on it. Nobody is interested to see only the general stats of his own team when he clicks there. LIke before, the general stats, below that the riders.
-Again the window/box whatever isn't wide enough... make sure everything fits, no "sliding" (still trying to figure out the correct word...) For example form column is wide because of 90.625-. First of all the - is wrong, second displaying the correct value is very nice, but maybe cut it off or write it smaller, the whole team thing should be visible at once.

Riders-Table as the default (instead of the Team-Table) can be a quick fix.

But I also agree that the Riders-Table in the Team-Tab is too crowded. The ideal solution would be to hide some columns by default and then users can discover the other columns later. Alternatively, the Rider-"Stats" and -"Palmares" could be seperated from the Rider-Skills, which managers are most interested in normally.

We'll be working on it (and the other suggestions as well later).

[Gipfelstuermer]

- cyclocross rankings, in german "Querfeldeinrennen" (Herbst/Winter)

- cyclocross rankings, in german "Querfeldeinrennen" (Herbst/Winter) --> easy one, can be defined as race series, but only few races with few participants

- your last answer gets me another inspired thought - a race series (Bike Infection or Gletschertrophy it was called) i was riding years ago was, "glocknerkönig (roadbike)" and "kitzsteinhorn (mountainbike)". maybe we get an rsf race series with the other paves races and some mountainbike races and combi with rsf roadraces.

I implemented this one as it was good practice before I also implemented World Tour 2023 Very easy ranking: 100 points per win.

Maybe later in 2023 we can have a race series combining different gravel races or similar. I like the idea obviously, even though we have to be careful not to put too many of those races, so it will depend on how popular gravel races are and how many active players we have.

[Gipfelstuermer]

Following things implemented in v1.10.1

- Teams: Split it into 2 different tabs, there's a lot of new nice stuff there, and yes, filters there too, but IMO always bad when you can slide sideways, then the whole tab somehow becomes annoying. (and add races this month since you're at it, useful stuff even, not just for pleasure)

a) numbers! Who's first etc. There in race series, not in split stuff

And again about TEAM, since we don't have a separate thread for that (yet? better to make one?)

- Put in the riders directly after you first click on it. Nobody is interested to see only the general stats of his own team when he clicks there. LIke before, the general stats, below that the riders.
-Again the window/box whatever isn't wide enough... make sure everything fits, no "sliding" (still trying to figure out the correct word...) For example form column is wide because of 90.625-. First of all the - is wrong, second displaying the correct value is very nice, but maybe cut it off or write it smaller, the whole team thing should be visible at once.

Then, some features are more complicated, but we hope to find solutions long-term:

d) Make all the riders and teams clickable, link it. (everywhere, there's that problem in other places too, team ex riders for example)

Some of those were solved with the recent version, team ex riders for example, but might still not be clickable everywhere. If we have a list where it is not yet working, that would help.

- Ex riders: Still takes ages to load, I propose going back to the old system... display just 100 (or 200) per page, instead of loading the whole 6300. But then show us all, not just 3000 points plus

b) race series took me quite a while to load

Loading never easy to manage with this amount of data. "Going back to the old system" not really an option unless you make Flash work again! Little joke, but serious because we have not yet found a good pagination library for React which also allows custom formatting which we need in those same tables.

f) Riders sorting by family name, not by first name!
1) Default sorting back to family name!!!!!!!!!!
2) No sorting by first name

This one, we had it solved before, but then we introduced those standardized tables with filtering, where a name is first name + last name, so sorting defaults to first name. Maybe Alkworld has a solution.

Then, the following two are on the list, even if exclamation marks dont help in implementing it faster afaik.

Then: Add the stuff that was there before!! Meaning: TRANSFERS! At least one team (Big Donkey) used that regularly!

3) Placement!!!!! HOw am I to know where I ended up in March 2013 otherwise?

Then, two debatable things. Would be helpful to hear more opinions:

- Colors in the stat screens (and everywhere except races I think) are still this low contrast not very pleasing grey-white. Why not make it the same nice colors as in the race screen?

c) Make the default absolute numbers, not weighted

[Hansa]

Then: Add the stuff that was there before!! Meaning: TRANSFERS! At least one team (Big Donkey) used that regularly!

3) Placement!!!!! HOw am I to know where I ended up in March 2013 otherwise?

Then, two debatable things. Would be helpful to hear more opinions.

yes please i also used both of these things from time to time to check some things

[Gipfelstuermer]

yes please i also used both of these things from time to time to check some things

Sry, I meant this:

Then, two debatable things. Would be helpful to hear more opinions:

- Colors in the stat screens (and everywhere except races I think) are still this low contrast not very pleasing grey-white. Why not make it the same nice colors as in the race screen?

c) Make the default absolute numbers, not weighted

[flockmastoR]

yes please i also used both of these things from time to time to check some things

Sry, I meant this:

Then, two debatable things. Would be helpful to hear more opinions:

- Colors in the stat screens (and everywhere except races I think) are still this low contrast not very pleasing grey-white. Why not make it the same nice colors as in the race screen?

c) Make the default absolute numbers, not weighted

Last thing is clear: ABSOLUTE NUMBERS first.
First thing: Distinguishable rows are now given with the white/grey scheme. Don't need colors

[Alkworld]

c) Make the default absolute numbers, not weighted

Last thing is clear: ABSOLUTE NUMBERS first.
First thing: Distinguishable rows are now given with the white/grey scheme. Don't need colors

Different opinion here: I think the weighted ranking is way more relevant. But either way, the other ranking is always only one click away.

[flockmastoR]

c) Make the default absolute numbers, not weighted

Last thing is clear: ABSOLUTE NUMBERS first.
First thing: Distinguishable rows are now given with the white/grey scheme. Don't need colors

Different opinion here: I think the weighted ranking is way more relevant. But either way, the other ranking is always only one click away.

It is basically something you made up out of nothing. It is not relevant for the divisional rankings, for promotion or relegation. Furthermore it just has relevance in the time of low participation (which is more or less the case for the last 2-3 years). If you want to indroduce this as somehow a relevant factor, a discussion about the weighted calculation may be necessary. For me, the World Tour winner would be the team/rider with the highest number of points. With such great influence of the number of teams (and no cap) the weights are too important (second place is better with just 3 teams more than a win in a 3 teams smaller group).

[Gipfelstuermer]

It is basically something you made up out of nothing. It is not relevant for the divisional rankings, for promotion or relegation.

The division points and the finances also depend on the number of teams per race. Nothing made up, just as Buhmann implemented it at some point in time. So it seems natural that the World Tour rankings are also weighted (even if technically not 100% in the same way because the weighting applies not only for <10 teams).

Perhaps Poke has an opinion, too. He created the first World Tour statistics. Without weighting of course as he didn't have all the info in his Excel. Rapid Vitesse and I only helped to keep it alive later on.

In the end, as Alkworld said correctly, whatever is decided, the other ranking is just one click away, if we want it.

[flockmastoR]

It is basically something you made up out of nothing. It is not relevant for the divisional rankings, for promotion or relegation.

The division points and the finances also depend on the number of teams per race. Nothing made up, just as Buhmann implemented it at some point in time. So it seems natural that the World Tour rankings are also weighted (even if technically not 100% in the same way because the weighting applies not only for <10 teams).

Perhaps Poke has an opinion, too. He created the first World Tour statistics. Without weighting of course as he didn't have all the info in his Excel. Rapid Vitesse and I only helped to keep it alive later on.

In the end, as Alkworld said correctly, whatever is decided, the other ranking is just one click away, if we want it.

Of course it is made up. Because the downweighing of <10 teams groups is not the same as upweighting 13 teams groups compared to 10 teams groups. I find it interesting, but IF we want that be a relevant factor (i.e. giving a palmares entry for World Tour Winner in the future) we have to discuss if we agree in that kind of weighting. As it is now, I have no problem with this new metric being visible there but would favour having the total points as the main factor (as it was before)

[Gipfelstuermer]

Because the downweighing of <10 teams groups is not the same as upweighting 13 teams groups compared to 10 teams groups.

Would be interesting to know why it was done like that originally for division points and money. Can't really think of a reason why 9 teams should be different from 10 teams but 11 teams should not be different from 10 teams.

[Robyklebt]

Would be interesting to know why it was done like that originally for division points and money. Can't really think of a reason why 9 teams should be different from 10 teams but 11 teams should not be different from 10 teams.

The game wasn't conceived for 10 teams, 10 teams isn't the base.
10 was decided to be the minimum number of teams necessary to get the full points/money, everything below that too easy, not worthy of full benefits. But 10 shouldn't be made the base of anything either now. If differentiating between 10+11 teams is deemed to be necessary, then the base should be 22 teams/race.

As long as it's something like the race series in the end don't care too much, just would prefer to have the absolute numbers as standard, how the weighted stuff a not too important toy. For other stuff I'll fight against the misunderstanding that 10 could be a base for anything harder.

More interested in this:

First thing: Distinguishable rows are now given with the white/grey scheme. Don't need colors

It's just not very appealing, this low contrast. What do you like better, the stronger race screen contrast or the grey-white for the rest? For me clear, race screen! Grey-white looks so unexciting work-like...

[flockmastoR]

It's just not very appealing, this low contrast. What do you like better, the stronger race screen contrast or the grey-white for the rest? For me clear, race screen! Grey-white looks so unexciting work-like...

Well, in a normal race screen, you don't have all single riders groups all the time. With the alternate color coded contrast it is just to busy for my eyes. Ok with it in the race. It's a pro to see fast what rider is with whom after a sieb. In the statistics part, I just don't want to lose the right line, which for my taste is given. But if many vote for more contrast, I am ok too.

[Schartner Bombe]

if I haven't miscalculated after todays race.

in Team Rider Stats sum of points 6.695
in Statistics Division Team 6.694

[Alkworld]

if I haven't miscalculated after todays race.

in Team Rider Stats sum of points 6.695
in Statistics Division Team 6.694

Technically, there are two data sources, which are maintained separately:
- points per rider (saved with each rider)
- team points (saved with team)
In your case, at least one is wrong But no idea idea where this came from

[flockmastoR]

if I haven't miscalculated after todays race.

in Team Rider Stats sum of points 6.695
in Statistics Division Team 6.694

Technically, there are two data sources, which are maintained separately:
- points per rider (saved with each rider)
- team points (saved with team)
In your case, at least one is wrong But no idea idea where this came from

Looks like there is a rounding issue in one of those?

[Schartner Bombe]

if I haven't miscalculated after todays race.

in Team Rider Stats sum of points 6.695
in Statistics Division Team 6.694

Technically, there are two data sources, which are maintained separately:
- points per rider (saved with each rider)
- team points (saved with team)
In your case, at least one is wrong But no idea idea where this came from

Looks like there is a rounding issue in one of those?

same today but
- sum eternal points go with sum points per rider
- but season points in Div stats are 1 point less

[flockmastoR]

Filtering Nations

I like the possibility to filter with regular expression, BUT when trying to filter by nation (wanted to check something for NC) there is a problem. The game uses inconsistent country codes. Some countres are encoded by 3 letters USA, others with 2 letters CH and some with just 1 letter A. When I want to filter for Austrian riders and type "A" I just find all riders from a country with at least an "A" in the 1-3 letters country code (and thats a lot for A). I can overcome that using regular expressions by typing in

^A$

Better would be to get the Austrian riders easier. For all looking for exact matches with <3 letters you can use the pattern, like

^CH$

for Switzerland, when you want to exclude the riders from Chile (RCH)

And if you are not sure about the country code, right click on the flag -> Copy url -> paste url in browser and check the country code at the end of the url

PS: edited it because Alk showed a shortcut

[Robyklebt]

Stats

Transfers: Quite a lot missing, any chance of getting that back? Right now it starts at 2022-10-26. The whole history... Ok, see the problem with the data overload.... but still, Donks likes! Filter, calendar there btw I get a red exclamation mark. Since the whole history is probably kind of difficult, maybe somehow make it possible to get the history you want AFTER putting in filters, so sale, 2016-01-01 to 2016-12-31 click on something like refresh and THEN it loads all those and only those records?

Ex Riders: Browser problems, yep, my computer fairly new, but when I click on all, simply nothing happens. Maybe a solution like the one proposed above, if I want to search for Emil Rösti, I somehow can find him (bad example, I find him in my team). Right now there I can't. Basically try to make everybody findable somehow.

The nationality thing you were all talking about btw way to complicated for me, something simple might be nice at some point.

Team screen, still no own thread:

-Hm, my idea really was to have both team and riders on the same page at the start. For people on PC certainly nicer, but ok, tablet/mobile people maybe better like this. But as a PC guy I'd prefer to see both at once. But already prefer the solution now to the one before.
-Bigger problem:
a) Mentioned it a long time ago, but would be really nice to have a less abrupt ending, the page ends right after the end of that box/tab whatever with the riders in.
b) Make that box/tab big enough for 20 riders. Right now I see 17,25 riders, and then have to scroll the box. Make it 20 riders! Without having to scroll. Same thing as Buhmann did right now, for some reason he thought not being able to see all riders was a good idea too....Bigger box, a few rows of c4f blue at the end, just nice than this sudden end to the page (same in home, inscription, probably most of the rest too, interestingly enough in races it seems to have some rows at the end. It's most annoying in team though, if you don't see why, try it yourself)

[flockmastoR]

Ex Riders: Browser problems, yep, my computer fairly new, but when I click on all, simply nothing happens. Maybe a solution like the one proposed above, if I want to search for Emil Rösti, I somehow can find him (bad example, I find him in my team). Right now there I can't. Basically try to make everybody findable somehow.

Yeah, agree. Don't know if the filtering can be done before the database request is sent. But would make sense at least until the performance problems are solved (if this can be done)

Mentioned it a long time ago, but would be really nice to have a less abrupt ending, the page ends right after the end of that box/tab whatever with the riders in.

True, there are some pages "Home", "Statistics", "Chat", were a little border on bottom of the page would be nice. I always think I am missing something down there.