Re: New transfer system for youth riders
Posted: Wed May 11, 2011 6:55 pm
Radunion
No, the goal isn't necessarily to make them more expensive. Although a certain market adjustment in the prices is more than welcome. A certain type of rider needs to go cheaper. For the moment all the reg guys basically. Especially sprinters and so on. Niche riders like Hubers and Alighieris (bought on the 21 one, grrr) probably as well. Others wil lautomatically go for more. the 56-74-79, he will go for more too right now as well. But already the 56-72-75 could go for 95% right now.
There are 180 teams bidding for 144*30 riders a month. 4320 riders for 180 teams. YES, of those 4320 many are shit. Yes. But too many are not.
Climbers? Right now 'only' 6 73 on. One a 73-54-70-50-46 with 58 reg for 3'142'xxx. Fairly sure he will not be bought. He has 5 downhill too few to be a real real topstar.
Then a 71-51-79-60-54 with 56 reg. Another very strong guy. not my type at all, who wants 60 TT- 3'390'xxx. He will not be bought either I suspect. Only 51 flat, wäää. And expensive. And the whole month there have been strong climbers on the market. Some bought, some not bought. Because with so many riders offered everybody can afford to wait a bit longer, the next 73-55-75 will be coming sooner or later. Why take the 73-54-70 in that case?
Sprinters? Lots this month, again, the one by ZL was bought for 100k less he says... the perfect one 50-59 was bought way over market value again. But 50-58 already isn't. And 50-55 doesn't even get offers it seems (at least that's the one I think I bid on and nobody wanted him) Right now too, there are a few good sprinters. That very likely won't get bought. 48-59 82 sprint, but 64 reg. No problem if somebody like that goes cheaper. But he very likely won't go at all. Rightly so, with the high amount of sprinters that seem to be there this month (did buh change the percentages????, seems much more than last month) Another one 48-57 with 82 sprint, only 55 reg. This one better other skills, downhill, no TT, 2,3x market value. This is a guy that really should be bought. Will he? If I was looking for a sprinter I would wait a bit longer. wait for the 49-59 with 50 reg that will be a bit cheaper again...
What's the point of giving everybody everything he wants. Skull in another thread wrote "RSF needs stars" Right. Of course he went at it exactly the wrong way... he wanted to let us design our dream rider, so to have 180 dream riders a month, 180 potential stars, which of course in the end means: Nobody is a star, just lots and lots and lots and lots of riders with superb values. If we want stars not everybody can have one, since otherwise nobody is a star... Simple, no?
Right now there are 4320 riders available per month! FOUR THOUSAND THREE HUNDRED AND TWENTY! More if the month had 31 days.. For 180 teams. How many 20 year old will those guys buy on average in a month? Last month it was shockingly low, might be because some waited for the 1-5 market, some scared of high prices bought before. But I'd be surprised if on AVERAGE it's more than 100. Before we had 9000 riders per month I think, on average a new market every 3 days if I'm not mistaken. So let's say double. But for more than double the teams. 170 D5 teams have a race this season so far. Of the 180D1-4 teams it's 158. And my GUESS is that D5 actually buys more youth riders on average. There's 511 21 years olds in the game right now. And NO WAY even close to half are bought by D1-4. And I seriously doubt more than 50 were bought in the auctions in D1-4. Buh sent me his list to analyze, never know he he likes it when I then write the numbers openly.. but anyway, a few days before the first of May, 35 riders had been bought in auctions... That number probably increased in the last days, yes, but doubt it went to even close to 100. The rest was bought on the 1-5 market by D1-4 and in D5. Back to the point, more riders available for D1-4 than before. Plus they can be had cheaper. Is THAT the point of the reform? I think not.
So back to the original question, increase in price: As I said, for some yes. Low reg definetly, their market price is just actually too low, since when Buhmann did his reform in 2008? with the 30" tact and the colours for tempo, the reg has just become much more unimportant. And since the prices weren't adapted, reg is hopelessly overpriced right now (The joke of the whole thing still is that Buhmann at the time said, it should become more difficult for 35 reg guys to be competitive in tours...) so if you ask me if a rider with very good skills and 35-40 reg should become more expensive, I clearly say YES.
Just too many riders.
So Buhmann:
-Interval 15 min.
-MAYBE later adjust the frequency of the different rider types.
-viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1502 Yes, introduce one of the 2 limits now.
A solution for the D5+ youth market.
- No idea about D6 right now, do they get them? See pro and contra, don't really care.
- 6b gets the same treatment as D5
- For both the viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1502 counts as well.
- My favorite solution right now (it changes every 2 minutes...) give them the leftovers from D1-4 auctions for 95% of the price. And let the guys that fall down just stay there the rest of the month.
Normal market:
D1-4
-Only 21-24 'name geben' for D1-4. With new top and low values, which I will write in a few minutes or hours, since loading any RSF page right now takes me 2 minutes....
-With auctions too obviously
-Sold riders: Auctions. Including the "Verbilligung". Details once you start programming, so in 2 days. That's an order.
-Riders on the market: 30 days without an offer=retire.
D5-6:
- "name geben" until 27 or 28 like now. Values later.
- Non auction system like now.
- No "Verbilligungen" in D5. They make no sense. Why were they introduced? Do you remember. I do. So that known riders, not only stars, who get sold with 29 or so still have a chance to find another team. There are no known stars in D5, there's only shit that wins shitraces. No need to make shit cheaper. Advantage of D1-4: You get cheaper sold riders. Stop trying not to "punish" D5+. They need to get some advantages, for the start, but there have to be some disadvantages as well. No cheapened riders is one. Better name geben is an advantage that of course has to stay.
- Riders sold in D5 with not enough races, 20 at least, get deleted automatically regardless of won points. Then over 50 races OR over 500 points they get on the market, otherwise deleted. Under 20 races as I said kicked immediately.
That should keep you busy for a week, will post the next step in a week or so.
Oh, Franconiapost: No Franconia, ZL doesn't have to see that. There were a few good sprinters not bought in April too. But yes, it looks like our Buh could have changed something there. And made it worse... Right now there are shitloads of sprinters.
Aripost too: Yep, right now none there it seems. But shitloads of 54-72-70+ 5 plus a Leupold. The guy with 64+ sprint will come sooner or later. Last month? Manuel Nicolas might qualify. Luc Ferns too, or too much reg?
No, the goal isn't necessarily to make them more expensive. Although a certain market adjustment in the prices is more than welcome. A certain type of rider needs to go cheaper. For the moment all the reg guys basically. Especially sprinters and so on. Niche riders like Hubers and Alighieris (bought on the 21 one, grrr) probably as well. Others wil lautomatically go for more. the 56-74-79, he will go for more too right now as well. But already the 56-72-75 could go for 95% right now.
There are 180 teams bidding for 144*30 riders a month. 4320 riders for 180 teams. YES, of those 4320 many are shit. Yes. But too many are not.
Climbers? Right now 'only' 6 73 on. One a 73-54-70-50-46 with 58 reg for 3'142'xxx. Fairly sure he will not be bought. He has 5 downhill too few to be a real real topstar.
Then a 71-51-79-60-54 with 56 reg. Another very strong guy. not my type at all, who wants 60 TT- 3'390'xxx. He will not be bought either I suspect. Only 51 flat, wäää. And expensive. And the whole month there have been strong climbers on the market. Some bought, some not bought. Because with so many riders offered everybody can afford to wait a bit longer, the next 73-55-75 will be coming sooner or later. Why take the 73-54-70 in that case?
Sprinters? Lots this month, again, the one by ZL was bought for 100k less he says... the perfect one 50-59 was bought way over market value again. But 50-58 already isn't. And 50-55 doesn't even get offers it seems (at least that's the one I think I bid on and nobody wanted him) Right now too, there are a few good sprinters. That very likely won't get bought. 48-59 82 sprint, but 64 reg. No problem if somebody like that goes cheaper. But he very likely won't go at all. Rightly so, with the high amount of sprinters that seem to be there this month (did buh change the percentages????, seems much more than last month) Another one 48-57 with 82 sprint, only 55 reg. This one better other skills, downhill, no TT, 2,3x market value. This is a guy that really should be bought. Will he? If I was looking for a sprinter I would wait a bit longer. wait for the 49-59 with 50 reg that will be a bit cheaper again...
What's the point of giving everybody everything he wants. Skull in another thread wrote "RSF needs stars" Right. Of course he went at it exactly the wrong way... he wanted to let us design our dream rider, so to have 180 dream riders a month, 180 potential stars, which of course in the end means: Nobody is a star, just lots and lots and lots and lots of riders with superb values. If we want stars not everybody can have one, since otherwise nobody is a star... Simple, no?
Right now there are 4320 riders available per month! FOUR THOUSAND THREE HUNDRED AND TWENTY! More if the month had 31 days.. For 180 teams. How many 20 year old will those guys buy on average in a month? Last month it was shockingly low, might be because some waited for the 1-5 market, some scared of high prices bought before. But I'd be surprised if on AVERAGE it's more than 100. Before we had 9000 riders per month I think, on average a new market every 3 days if I'm not mistaken. So let's say double. But for more than double the teams. 170 D5 teams have a race this season so far. Of the 180D1-4 teams it's 158. And my GUESS is that D5 actually buys more youth riders on average. There's 511 21 years olds in the game right now. And NO WAY even close to half are bought by D1-4. And I seriously doubt more than 50 were bought in the auctions in D1-4. Buh sent me his list to analyze, never know he he likes it when I then write the numbers openly.. but anyway, a few days before the first of May, 35 riders had been bought in auctions... That number probably increased in the last days, yes, but doubt it went to even close to 100. The rest was bought on the 1-5 market by D1-4 and in D5. Back to the point, more riders available for D1-4 than before. Plus they can be had cheaper. Is THAT the point of the reform? I think not.
So back to the original question, increase in price: As I said, for some yes. Low reg definetly, their market price is just actually too low, since when Buhmann did his reform in 2008? with the 30" tact and the colours for tempo, the reg has just become much more unimportant. And since the prices weren't adapted, reg is hopelessly overpriced right now (The joke of the whole thing still is that Buhmann at the time said, it should become more difficult for 35 reg guys to be competitive in tours...) so if you ask me if a rider with very good skills and 35-40 reg should become more expensive, I clearly say YES.
Just too many riders.
So Buhmann:
-Interval 15 min.
-MAYBE later adjust the frequency of the different rider types.
-viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1502 Yes, introduce one of the 2 limits now.
A solution for the D5+ youth market.
- No idea about D6 right now, do they get them? See pro and contra, don't really care.
- 6b gets the same treatment as D5
- For both the viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1502 counts as well.
- My favorite solution right now (it changes every 2 minutes...) give them the leftovers from D1-4 auctions for 95% of the price. And let the guys that fall down just stay there the rest of the month.
Normal market:
D1-4
-Only 21-24 'name geben' for D1-4. With new top and low values, which I will write in a few minutes or hours, since loading any RSF page right now takes me 2 minutes....
-With auctions too obviously
-Sold riders: Auctions. Including the "Verbilligung". Details once you start programming, so in 2 days. That's an order.
-Riders on the market: 30 days without an offer=retire.
D5-6:
- "name geben" until 27 or 28 like now. Values later.
- Non auction system like now.
- No "Verbilligungen" in D5. They make no sense. Why were they introduced? Do you remember. I do. So that known riders, not only stars, who get sold with 29 or so still have a chance to find another team. There are no known stars in D5, there's only shit that wins shitraces. No need to make shit cheaper. Advantage of D1-4: You get cheaper sold riders. Stop trying not to "punish" D5+. They need to get some advantages, for the start, but there have to be some disadvantages as well. No cheapened riders is one. Better name geben is an advantage that of course has to stay.
- Riders sold in D5 with not enough races, 20 at least, get deleted automatically regardless of won points. Then over 50 races OR over 500 points they get on the market, otherwise deleted. Under 20 races as I said kicked immediately.
That should keep you busy for a week, will post the next step in a week or so.
Oh, Franconiapost: No Franconia, ZL doesn't have to see that. There were a few good sprinters not bought in April too. But yes, it looks like our Buh could have changed something there. And made it worse... Right now there are shitloads of sprinters.
Aripost too: Yep, right now none there it seems. But shitloads of 54-72-70+ 5 plus a Leupold. The guy with 64+ sprint will come sooner or later. Last month? Manuel Nicolas might qualify. Luc Ferns too, or too much reg?