NC - Barbados - Save the planet TeamAttack

[AlmavivaItalia]

Km: 5, Pendenza: 0
Aaron Silver (Save the Planet) Attacco al km

Km: 4, Pendenza: -2
Arthur Barclay (peitsche racing) Attacco al km
Simon Culpepper (Save the Planet) Attacco al km
Silvio Barclay (peitsche racing) Attacco al km
Walt Huddlestone (Save the Planet) Attacco al km

Km: 3, Pendenza: 2
Thomas Brathwaite (AlmavivaItalia) Attacco al km
Bob Fraiter (Pavler) contrattacca
Carl Jagger (Save the Planet) Attacco al km
Keith Watts (Save the Planet) Attacco al km
John Brathwaite (AlmavivaItalia) Attacco al km

Km: 2, Pendenza: -2
Garfield Sobers (Save the Planet) Attacco al km

Km: 1, Pendenza: 0
Charles Mountbatten (Save the Planet) Attacco al km
Michael Brathwaite (AlmavivaItalia) Attacco al km
Walton Thompson (Lotto omega) Attacco al km
Rihanna Fenty (Save the Planet) Attacco al km
Miguel Lampard (peitsche racing) Attacco al km
Chris Maikel (peitsche racing) Attacco al km
Riki Jovanel (Galactico Porti) Attacco al km
John Kyles (Lotto omega) Attacco al km


all the attacks come from the main group

[AlmavivaItalia]

i can add a chained attack

Km: 55, Pendenza: -1
Walton Thompson (Lotto omega) Attacco al km
John Kyles (Lotto omega) Attacco al km
Chris Maikel (peitsche racing) Attacco al km
Carl Jagger (Save the Planet) contrattacca
Bob Fraiter (Pavler) contrattacca
Rihanna Fenty (Save the Planet) contrattacca
John Brathwaite (AlmavivaItalia) contrattacca
Simon Culpepper (Save the Planet) contrattacca

[peitsche racing]

Pavler: was hat das damit zu tun wie viele fahrer ich hab??
Save the Planet: an schaß hab ich!
Pavler: du hast jetzt gegen die regel verstoßen und musst 2 fahrer fallen lassen...
Save the Planet: Komm, Pavler, schreibs ins fairnessforum mit deinem einen fahrer, komm schon!
Save the Planet: pavler, gehts noch?
Pavler: save, 2 fallen lassen...
Lotto omega: tempo ?
Lotto omega: pavler ?
Save the Planet: musst nicht in der 3. person mit mir reden peitsche
Pavler: wenn die gruppen zusammenkommen musste aber 2 fallen lassen
peitsche racing: dann atacken wa halt seine leute müde alle...
Save the Planet: hast dich ja vorher nicht am chat beteiligt, von daher kanns dich nicht allzu sehr nerven....
peitsche racing: save nun hast gegen die regeln verstoßen
AlmavivaItalia: chained attack?
Pavler: es nervt einfach nur übertrieben, aber nein ich kann dir nichs vorschreiben, genauso wenig wie du es anderen verbieten kannst ihr meinung zu äußern
peitsche racing: verhangene team atack!
Save the Planet: ich hör auf, wenn ich aufhören will, is das ok für dich???
Save the Planet: der nächste der mir sagen will was ich zu tun habe, unfassbar!
Pavler: und jetzt hör endlich auf, die aktion is vorbei
Pavler: er sagt ja auch net dass es gegen die regel is, sondern in seinen augen unfair und komisch...
Save the Planet: späßchen? hab keines bemerkt. wo war eines?
Save the Planet: "sodass diese Fahrer innerhalb einer Gruppe vorzufinden sind" --- means to me that it´s not important from where they com from
Pavler: die übersetzung weil dus net verstanden hast oder des kleine späßchen?
Save the Planet: was soll das jetzt pavler?
Pavler: der englischen sprache biste anscheind net so mächtig ;P
AlmavivaItalia: or you started with 2 riders at km 1... 1 at km2 and others?
AlmavivaItalia: so someone started from the back?
Pavler: er hat grad geschrieben dass alle ausm peloton kamen, nicht dass sie dann in der gleichen gruppe warn
AlmavivaItalia: no?
Save the Planet: the riders WERE NOT IN THE SAME GROUP!!!!! if u like it or not!
AlmavivaItalia: the riders were all from the main starting group so it isn't a good behavìour
AlmavivaItalia: posted into forum...
Save the Planet: willst du jetzt eure ungerechtfertigte intervention damit rechtfertigen??? lass mich mein rennen so fahren, wie ich es will, ob es für dich logisch oder unlogisch ist, ich quatsch dir in deines auch nicht rein!
peitsche racing: trotzdem sedhr unlogisch deine aktion... du würdest ein sprint locker gewinnen und reißt aus mit allen flachfahrern....
Save the Planet: zumindest fühl ich mich verarscht...
peitsche racing: das hat nix mit verarschen zu tun.
Save the Planet: ab mein wille da war oder nicht ist völlig unerheblich - außerdem stimmts nicht, weil ich vorne grün davon gefahren bin. ihr habt mich ganz einfach verarscht hier, so schauts aus!
Save the Planet: ich bin der deutschen sprache durchaus soweit mächtig, dass ich so eine regel auszulegen vermag, da brauch ich kein forum dazu
peitsche racing: der wille von dir war da mit mehr als 5 fahrern in einer gruppe zu fahren. und das innerhalb der ersten 20km bzw in der ersten rennhälfte.
peitsche racing: und durch das zurück fallen lassen gilt das dann auch. aber kannst dich gern im forum unter fairplay nochmal schlau machen bzw nachfragen.
Save the Planet: wären, wären, wären, völlig uninteressant!
Save the Planet: AlmavivaItalia: save are you joking? you attack with your entire team-------> why joking, that aint a normal race!
peitsche racing: sie wären es aber würde vorn nicht ein offler fahren. und dann wäre das ne krasse team atack
Save the Planet: the riders were NOT IN THE SAME GROUP!!!!! ---- and u forced me to drop them, maaaaaaaa!
AlmavivaItalia: save are you joking? you attack with your entire team
AlmavivaItalia: posting into fairplay
Save the Planet: I DIDN`T NEED TO DROP - that was a bad mistake guys!!!
Save the Planet: ma du he!!!
Pavler: wieso fährste eig noch im peloton?
Save the Planet: das steht hier nicht, verdammt!!!
peitsche racing: fährst du zusammen trifft dies aber zu.
Save the Planet: so dass diese Fahrer innerhalb einer Gruppe vorzufinden sind -----------> verdammte scheisse, ich hätte NICHT Fallen lassen müssen!!!!
AlmavivaItalia: are you joking save?
Pavler: 2. Erfolgreiche Angriffe (kein Mitgehen!) von mehr als 5 verschiedenen Fahrern einer Mannschaft innerhalb von 20 Kilometern, so dass diese Fahrer innerhalb einer Gruppe vorzufinden sind.Diese Regel gilt nur innerhalb der ersten Rennhälfte.
Save the Planet: show me that rule
peitsche racing: thanks
peitsche racing: because you only can atack with 5 rider in 20km every rider more is a team atack!
Save the Planet: ??? why that
AlmavivaItalia: you need to drop 3 riders
Save the Planet: nope
peitsche racing: save in 20km MAX 5 rider atack out!
AlmavivaItalia: save team attack




der chatlog bis dahin...... er ist derzeit mit 7 fahrern in der großen gruppe..... dir alle samt im ersten halbteil der etappe atackiert hat..... ich bitte da doch mal die regel klar auszulegen. mit seinen team atacken und unfairern fahrweise zerstört er eine ganze nationale meisterschafft

[save the planet]

lebenslange sperre, oder was willst du von mir peitsche???

[team fl]

lebenslange sperre, oder was willst du von mir peitsche???

Ich nehme an, dass du die Regeln befolgst.

[Widar]

Den hier vorliegenden Sachverhalt habe ich an das Fair-Play-Komitee weitergeleitet. Die Mitglieder des Komitees haben nun die Möglichkeit sich darüber zu beraten und jeweils einen eigenen Vorschlag zu machen. Es kann unter Umständen einige Zeit dauern, bis eine abschließende Entscheidung durch Buhmann getroffen wird. MfG, Widar

[peitsche racing]

was ich möchte ist einfach die klärung.... man kann anhand des chats ja sehen das irgendwie keiner wirklich weiß was nun erlaubt ist und was nicht....

ich fordere hier nix. sollte das comitee beschließen das die fahrweise bzw das atackieren unfair bzw gegen die regeln war dann sollten sie entscheiden.

mir ist in erster linie nur wichtig das wir auch mal hier antwort bekommen was nun "legal" ist und was nicht.... weil der regelauszug der auch im rennchat gepostet wurde der lässt ja einige lücken zu......

[flockmastoR]

Successful attack (no following) with more than 5 different riders of one team during 20 km ( out of the same group) if these riders end up in the same group.

whats not clear about that rule?
Where all the "save the Planets" riders in the same group when the attacks started? Yes
Did he attack with more than 5 during 20km? Yes
Did they end up in the same group? As far as i followed it: NO or yes? dont know did he drop them before they reached the same group than its ok i think. But how did it go on then? did the groups than rode together? than it would been necessary to drop the rider anyway.

So it was against the rules

And to the chained team attack at km 55 it was a clear against the rule case too.
3 riders follow on the same km, it was not +4% or higher, it wasnt in the last 20km (I guess the race had more than 75 km)

I think the rule is really not good enough

[save the planet]

if these riders end up in the same group

------->>>> !!! They didn´t!!!

so it was NOT against the rules!

[AlmavivaItalia]

if these riders end up in the same group

------->>>> !!! They didn´t!!!

so it was NOT against the rules!

yes they didn't but explain why they didn't...

we need to attack, because you was bringing these riders in g1, so alternatively Peitsche and me attack
you chase every attack in g1, after you catch the attackers you stop tempo for having more help from the back...
then the situation goes completely strange, there was a completely strange attack and then you stop and a little group escape...

[save the planet]

I don´t have to explain the "WHY", because the rule says:"...if these riders end up in the same group" - there is no further condition included in this sentence!!! even if you think there should be one, morally.

Despite this YOU forced me to drop the riders - YOU and your friends in that race did everything to push me out of the race and rode together against me - YOU claim my "mad riding" in another thread --- but YOU are unable to admit, that in that case you and your friends were not right, that YOU did a mistake! THAT´s the disappointing thing!

[AlmavivaItalia]

I don´t have to explain the "WHY", because the rule says:"...if these riders end up in the same group" - there is no further condition included in this sentence!!! even if you think there should be one, morally.

Despite this YOU forced me to drop the riders - YOU and your friends in that race did everything to push me out of the race and rode together against me - YOU claim my "mad riding" in another thread --- but YOU are unable to admit, that in that case you and your friends were not right, that YOU did a mistake! THAT´s the disappointing thing!

you was with 6 riders in the same group, and i was wrong?????? they don't end up in the same group? no? ah, sure, no, because when they come one was following another rider escaped some kms before they reach the group.. then, when we compact all the group you drop all your riders so we haven't any evidence of the situation... right, but if you want to kidd me and everyone who read this post, you're welcome

I don't force all your team to drop... i simple ask (probably in a not properly fine kind, i was too aggressive, i admit) to drop the 3 (you attacks with 8 riders totally in the start) which was reaching the same group... but no, you chase if someone escapes and then wait, chase and wait (without escape, i'm sure you will have 8 riders in the same group, but you don't need this to win... you was the strongest in race). Dropping all the team was your decision... after your drop (unexpected) i was completely damaged because suddendly nobody was in the group, and i was the one with more riders (peitsche, with 4, had 2 tired because of you) but i need to chase and for this i lost my advantage, and i need completely to "re-organize my tactics". But this is not a problem, the problem is that focusing on a part of the rule only to have reason (and completely missing the break of the rule at km 55) is a very no good behaviour

[save the planet]

U wanna talk about behaviour?
OK, then tell me, is it good behaviour, that u three aggreed in "OK, let´s attack his riders dead" ? u did, my riders were in different wheels and so the chained team attack happened!!! to me and my race was definitely damaged in that moment! preach water and drink wine! how hypocritical that is!

[AlmavivaItalia]

U wanna talk about behaviour?
OK, then tell me, is it good behaviour, that u three aggreed in "OK, let´s attack his riders dead" ? u did, my riders were in different wheels and so the chained team attack happened!!! to me and my race was definitely damaged in that moment! preach water and drink wine! how hypocritical that is!

save... do you understand that this attack (km 55... where i was on the wheel, not for sure i do the attack as written in the log, i did before, but when you cut early the gap i stop... i was still follow my "raceplan", if you believe me) is only because you , instead of dropping the 6th, was waiting other two.. (or better, another one, because one of the twos are making red tempo, so probably when he reach the group he was tired).... i think you can do a better race if in the start you work for a MS... (and then in the end try to surprise someone of us with an escape)

[save the planet]

of course riding for a ms would have been better for my team and for the result. but thats not what we are talking about, we´re talking bout breaking the rule or not.
but anyway, race is over, flag is to another team, we should call it a day, virtualy shake our hands and find our peace again, what do you think?

[AlmavivaItalia]

but anyway, race is over, flag is to another team, we should call it a day, virtualy shake our hands and find our peace again, what do you think?

I agree... because this is a Game.

So hope having more riders to do better fight next Barbados NC^^