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Hi folks !

This topic has already been a bit discussed in the past, but I would like to introduce it to you again, with some specific ideas.
The Nopikouze idea to establish a classification based on the WT (viewtopic.php?f=34&t=2546) make me think that we can do the same for a fantasy RSF Tour during the winter months. November/December are "free" of real interesting races and full of fantasy races. We could develop a challenge, discussed here on the forum, to make these fantasy races more interesting.
We could imagine a topic for the rankings made after the races of this Winter RSF Tour, clear and efficient. And an other topic for the discussions, debates and roby megalong posts !

So, I explain you how I imagine this Winter RSF Tour, then I hope you will give me your opinions and say how you imagine this if you imagine this differently !

We should use :
The tours :
- El Campeonato de los Andes and December Tour as the 2 Main events.
- 2 or 3 other tours, shorter as the other "stage race events". We could vote for the ones we want (competition and vote ?), or choose among past tours (which could be drawn again, actualized) : JejuTour, 3j de Champagne, NRW Tour, Estérel ...

One day race "classics":
- 8-10 "classics" : 2flat/2MSpossible but difficult/2hilly/2HC/2pavé ?
- Choose these races in already known races we like (Flèche Jura, Bolkow-Bolkow, San Francisco Classic, Mosell Cup ...) or/and organize a competition between the designers to decide which races we use (we could include some past races in the competition !).

The idea is to know the races (profiles) and the dates before the beginning of November.
Some "classics" will be scheduled during the tours, we have to find the good balance in the calendar for November and December between tours and one day classics.
We are not forced to change the categorisation of the races, not a problem to let Andes cat3 and most of the one day races cat1-2 ! Because the ranking established here in the forum will have its own scale. We have to define a scale, well-balanced for the tours and one-day classic races. But is should be better if there are no cat 2-3 in the calendar which are not included in the Winter RSF Tour, to make it more attractive.

First try for this calendar, with the Basis of 2main tours and 3 little tours + 10 one day classics :

I like this idea. Would make these off-season months a bit more interesting maybe. Competition is always good.

2nd is that i would love to see my "San Francisco Classic" again this year.

Wanna bring the topic up again.

I really really like the idea, many teams will also like it I guess. First of all: How do Buhmann and leso feel about our own little RSF classification during off-season? Because I don't wanna draw races without hope to establish something like this.

Secondly, yes, wanna draw races! As classic race fan I would like to draw some hardcore classic races, both for 70-80s, climbers, maybe hard races for sprinters to win aswell. So it should be open for many riders to win those races. Right now I am thinking of geographical regions that have such climbs etc., maybe something tropical, south american, I will find something. My idea is to bring up 3-5 one day races and put them into an RSF week. I'll also provide a forum classification thread for this, will come up with it then. Maybe, if leso and Buhboy are very cool, they can make it instant cat. 2 or something to push the RSF-week, but probably they won't. Though really many managers seem to want something like an RSF-only-monument or special races, like we have with Fleche Jurasienne etc.

So question is: Are many users interested? If you are, you can help me aswell: Tell me your favourite geographical regions, your favourite kind of races, your ideas, etc. PN me if you want! If we get enough forum users to want this leso and Buh will probably implement those races this year already.

I like this ideea.Maybe som week tours with tt and hard climbs to in region when is not winter or in central Asia on Hymalaya or maybe in South America.And of course all kind of races to have all changes to win one.

I like the idea and i like the idea of drawing a 2nd NRW-Tour
I guess Leso will do to.

RSF Winter Tour

November

Campeonato de los Andes (15 days tour) cat. 3

Mosell Cup cat. 3
Bolkow-Bolkow cat. 3
Flech Jurasienne cat. 3

December

December Tour cat. 3
Christmas Tour cat. 2

GP Brescia, cat. 3
San Francisco Classic cat. 1 (OL's right, it's a great profile, keep it in the calender for this winter competition!)
Pavés de Noel cat. 3
La St. Sylv cat. 1 (request: just make it cat. 2 finally again, draw a classic race in France like the profile from 2009, maybe steeper, and keep it!)

January
GP Letzebuerg, cat. 2

These are races we already established, I say let's make them part of the winter competition. As we can see, there's still space for more races to fill the calender. My idea includes some new races: one small tour in November (as there are 2 in December, and we can do one aswell in November, why not?), and a new classic race week with 4 races in a geographical region we may choose. To make it special, the races need something like a cultural feature or background and can be a travel through neighbour countries etc. (I'd suggest the south asian part, many riders from Asia by now in RSF and there is not really enough especially for those countries as Italians have Giro d'Italia or Lombardia - you know what I mean). The geography of the regions can perfectly be used for classic one day races with many possible winners. With the added races the calender could look like this (I just make some designer suggestions including OL and me, if someone wants to join PN me):

November

Campeonato de los Andes cat. 3
Simultaneous tour 4-5 days, including flat stages and ITT, cat. 1 (OL said he can do this if I got him right)

Mosell Cup cat. 3
Bolkow-Bolkow cat. 3
Flech Jurasienne cat. 3
Classic week: 7 days, 4 one day races cat. 1 (OL and I can draw a race under the region concept, if others want to join - PN me, or write in this thread)

December

December Tour cat. 3
Christmas Tour cat. 2
2-3 days criterium during Dec-Tour, cat. 1 (I can do a little criterium, if others are interested aswell go ahead

GP Brescia cat. 3
San Francisco Classic cat. 1
La St. Sylv cat. 2
Designer's race cat. 1 - everyone can draw a race, OL and I (and if other experienced drawers want to join, sure, do) can decide which profile wins the competition

January
GP Letzebuerg, cat. 2

This brings up a big calender, the races would be used for a forum classification, something maybe like iBanesto does with his calender. My idea:

- One day races 5 best finishing riders get points (cat. 1{10, 6, 4, 2, 1}pts, cat. 2 {20, 12, 8, 4, 2}pts, cat. 3 {30, 18, 12, 6, 4}pts)
- Tours 10 best finishing riders get points (need to figure out the numbers here)
- Tour stages 3 best finishing riders get points (cat. 1{5, 3, 1}pts, cat. 2{10, 6, 2}pts, cat. 3{15, 9, 3}pts)
- maybe something else that could be added, like jerseys, or a new category, not necessarily

Who wins? All points are added to the team classification, the team with the most points wins. Also, the individual rider with the most points wins the rider classification.

Comments, questions, suggestions, critics?

EDITH: added GP Brescia, added GP Letzebuerg (yes, why not a race in January aswell)

With the real weather all the RSF classics are basically OUT in winter.

Mosell Cup too cold
Fleche Jurassienne. too cold
Bolkow Bolkow, too cold

And of course you forgot GP Brescia and GP Letzebuerg *ok jan 1 that one) that... too cold.

So what shall we do with these races? I mean, everyone likes this traditional races.

See if leso reschedules them

Robyklebt wrote:See if leso reschedules them

Or just put them technically in a climate region that has summer during this time, mediterranean like climate, f.e. South Africa, Argentina, Australia (Sidney). I think this should be possible. And as these races are fantasy anway, it doesn't matter much.

It matters! Purity!

Robyklebt wrote:It matters! Purity!

Only change it technically. Isn't that possible somehow? Without changine the race name and where it happens? Just in the background?

But if that is not wanted, then the should of course be held at a time/date when the fit in. And we have to create new possible RSF classics for the winter in regions, where it's nice and cosy.

Whats the problem of virtually racing by -15° as long as you're at home with a cup of warm coco ?

i think that its technically just not realist to race with minus degrees