cycling4freaks.com

Final PDF
January 2025

Races to be designed:
Tour Down Under >>> ECS
AlUla Tour >>> ECS
Classica Camp de Morvedre >>> Gip
Clàssica Comunitat Valenciana 1969 - Gran Premi València >>> Gip

Races to be checked:
Villawood Men's Classic >>> ECS
Gran Premio Castellón - Ruta de la Cerámica >>> Gip
Trofeo Calvià >>> ECS
Trofeo Felanitx-Ses Salines >>> ECS
Trofeo Serra Tramuntana >>> ECS


Legend
BLUE = Designer found
GREEN = DONE

I can do the tour down under.

I start with comparing the in-game calendar with the UCI calendar. I hope to keep this up in the future as well.

stage races
1/21/2025 - 1/26/2025 Santos Tour Down Under, 2.UWT - in calendar
1/28/2025 - 2/1/2025 AlUla Tour, KSA, 2.1 - should be ridden as there is no tour overlapping it and some strong riders and teams will be there

one-day races
1/25/2025 1/25/2025 Gran Premio Castellón - Ruta de la Cerámica ESP 1.1 - in calendar
1/26/2025 1/26/2025 Clàssica Comunitat Valenciana 1969 - Gran Premi València ESP 1.1 - in calendar
1/29/2025 1/29/2025 Trofeo Calvià ESP 1.1 - in calendar
1/30/2025 1/30/2025 Surf Coast Classic - Men AUS 1.1 - not in the calendar, could be ridden on 28. instead of the fantasy race.
1/30/2025 1/30/2025 Trofeo Felanitx-Ses Salines ESP 1.1 - in calendar
1/31/2025 1/31/2025 Trofeo Serra Tramuntana ESP 1.1 - in calendar

In summary, I see no reason not to ride ALUla, as it ends before the next stage races begin in February. The profile looks nice, and decent participation is expected in real life. Even if I had not checked the profile yet, the race in Australia would be preferable to a fantasy race.

Radunion wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 17, 2024 7:38 pm

In summary, I see no reason not to ride ALUla[...]

To name a few, reasons could be:
- It is only cat 2.1
- There are cat 1.1 one day races in parallel
- It is not only about category but also about participants (which WT teams have signed up?)
- The timing isn't perfect between TDU and the many tours we will likely have starting early Feb (whereas in other months UCI calendar is so empty we even add cat 0.0 stage races!)
- Someone will need to design it and it won't be the calendar manager
- It has never been ridden before in c4f, I think, for lack of popularity
- We have 3 other tours in the month already

Would any of those reasons be valid for you?

Having said that, if many people want to ride it, it's not impossible.

Gipfelstuermer wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 17, 2024 11:25 pm

Radunion wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 17, 2024 7:38 pm

In summary, I see no reason not to ride ALUla[...]

To name a few, reasons could be:

- It is not only about category but also about participants (which WT teams have signed up?)
.

Teams from this year's results: Bora, UAE, Jayco Alula, Cofidis, Movistar, Euskatel, Total Energies, Bahrain Victorious, Tudor, Uno X, Astana, Quickstep, DSM

-15th wrong fantasy race. Should be Itaburito
-Castellon+Valencia cat 2 and 8 riders better.
-That surf thing IF ridden certainly not on the wrong date. 30.01. then would have 2 one day races. No problem 02.02. has 3 of them, there makes sense to move one, but with 2 the logical thing is just to do 2 editions each. Or 3 each.
- Do we really need stuff like Classica Camp de Morvedre, x.2, in the calendar? Or preview? Isn't that a bit of designer-talent waste to have people spend time with stuff like this?
-Saudi race

Gipfelstuermer wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 17, 2024 11:25 pm

- Someone will need to design it and it won't be the calendar manager

That argument has my full support

Gipfelstuermer wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 17, 2024 11:25 pm

- The timing isn't perfect between TDU and the many tours we will likely have starting early Feb (whereas in other months UCI calendar is so empty we even add cat 0.0 stage races!)

I hope we don't add cat 0.0 anymore in season. The alpha gang will oppose every single attempt!

Gipfelstuermer wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 17, 2024 11:25 pm

- It has never been ridden before in c4f, I think, for lack of popularity

Better leave the thinking to others. It's never been ridden because usually it was parallel to Bessèges, or other stuff (I think).

If designed it fulfills all the criteria to be ridden, was surprised it wasn't in the preview actually.

Gipfelstuermer wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 17, 2024 11:25 pm

Radunion wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 17, 2024 7:38 pm

In summary, I see no reason not to ride ALUla[...]

To name a few, reasons could be:
- It is only cat 2.1
- There are cat 1.1 one day races in parallel
- It is not only about category but also about participants (which WT teams have signed up?)
- The timing isn't perfect between TDU and the many tours we will likely have starting early Feb (whereas in other months UCI calendar is so empty we even add cat 0.0 stage races!)
- Someone will need to design it and it won't be the calendar manager
- It has never been ridden before in c4f, I think, for lack of popularity
- We have 3 other tours in the month already

Would any of those reasons be valid for you?

Having said that, if many people want to ride it, it's not impossible.

Maybe this cannot be handled in a short post. But as this forum is no stranger to long an rumbling post I can give it a go myself. Feel free to stop reading it in the middle when it is too tiresome.

(1) We do not treat .1 and .Pro races very different here for good reason. Probably some here know the UCI system better then me, still a short reminder about the participation criteria.

.Pro

UCI WorldTeams (max 70%)
UCI ProTeams
UCI Continental teams (of the country the race is in)
National teams (of the country of the organizer)
UCI foreign continental teams (max. 2)

.1

UCI WorldTeams (max 50%)
UCI ProTeams
UCI continental teams
National teams

Apart from the obvious reason if a race attracts WorldTeams and a bit of prestige the higher category brings there is little benifits. As the difference between the categories is usually not a factor in calendar planning I do not see why it should be here.

(2) I do not see a conflict between one-day races and tours of the same category. Just let the managers decide.

(3) Trust me, I do at least minimal research before I suggest something here. At times the reasons are not good and others disagree with them, but they are always there. Thanks to Lenny for pointing last year's teams out.

(4) Actually the timing is perfect as there is no overlapping tour. There are always many overlapping tours and races in early spring and the in-game-callander should represent this. In February we will certainly need to prioritize one race over another or offer just 2 or even 1 time per tour.

(5) Well there could be somebody who is willing to design it. I have not done real races yet but I do think I could help out or even feel compelled to help out if my suggestions get approved. What I will not do is design races before a decision is made about riding them (there is no information yet anyway). This was done successfully last summer and was discouraging me from offering my help in discussions and designing.

(6) We never have done it is the worst reason for anything. Maybe it overlapped with other tours in the past or just nobody cared about it.

(7) Yes we have a couple of tours this month already but we will certainly have more tours in February and in fact in most months (maybe except Grand Tour month where we cut tours to avoid low participation.

All in all, I will do the calendar comparison feature not to annoy somebody but to further discussion. Too often it is just a this is the calendar and then somebody tries to get a race in because it looks nice for the team or the race is in their home country, a country they like, or similar reasons. just saying this is the UCI calender and this is the plan and we should have a reason why we drop races not the other way round. Honestly, I hate the tour I suggested in real life as it is sportwashing and marketing for a totalitarian country in the best case.

Tour Down Under Profiles are done.








Some comments:
tour down under:
what cat is the race?
Website says 7 riders/team- should it be more?
Final stage has some KOM's but I couldn't tell what category or if they're needed, since the race is completely flat

Villawood Men's Classic:
would design but don't know how to treat criteriums with time limits.

Alula Tour:
I would ride if it was designed, and could help design as well

ECS Cycling wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 19, 2024 4:21 pm

Some comments:
tour down under:
what cat is the race?
Website says 7 riders/team- should it be more?
Final stage has some KOM's but I couldn't tell what category or if they're needed, since the race is completely flat

should be 8 riders then because we ride real riders + 1 mostly but gip should set that correctly when uploading anyways
according to the tdu pdf i found on ther site its cat 3 KOM on the last stage on km 38
and 72

Hansa wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 19, 2024 4:29 pm

ECS Cycling wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 19, 2024 4:21 pm

Some comments:
tour down under:
what cat is the race?
Website says 7 riders/team- should it be more?
Final stage has some KOM's but I couldn't tell what category or if they're needed, since the race is completely flat

should be 8 riders then because we ride real riders + 1 mostly but gip should set that correctly when uploading anyways
according to the tdu pdf i found on ther site its cat 3 KOM on the last stage on km 38
and 72

Thanks, will implement now

Thanks for the fast job at down under !

Did you adjust manually the % of the climbs (and circuits) when it was the same climb done several times ?
If the 1st cat mountain of stages 2, 3 & 5 are the same one that the riders do several times, they look a bit different on the graph.
It's not compulsory, but I think most designer who do official profiles try to make the climbs similar when possible/required.

Should be fixed now

could we please change the Cyclocross races to 3 riders? 2 riders makes it preferable to not be main favo so you can have a helper for your leader so in end its damn near impossible for main favo to win

lennylenny wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 24, 2024 1:46 pm

could we please change the Cyclocross races to 3 riders? 2 riders makes it preferable to not be main favo so you can have a helper for your leader so in end its damn near impossible for main favo to win

Better to delete these useless races

lennylenny wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 24, 2024 1:46 pm

could we please change the Cyclocross races to 3 riders? 2 riders makes it preferable to not be main favo so you can have a helper for your leader so in end its damn near impossible for main favo to win

Which is a complete new experience. I liked it (but also I was able to win without being a favor)

Chemnitz Pro Cycling Team wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 24, 2024 8:59 pm

lennylenny wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 24, 2024 1:46 pm

could we please change the Cyclocross races to 3 riders? 2 riders makes it preferable to not be main favo so you can have a helper for your leader so in end its damn near impossible for main favo to win

Which is a complete new experience. I liked it (but also I was able to win without being a favor)

There was a discussion about it here which made me change it from 4 to 2 for this year. Now it can be discussed if 3 riders would be the ideal solution. Might just need more than 1 race for people to get used to this kind of race ?

Gipfelstuermer wrote: ↑

Wed Dec 25, 2024 11:09 pm

Chemnitz Pro Cycling Team wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 24, 2024 8:59 pm

lennylenny wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 24, 2024 1:46 pm

could we please change the Cyclocross races to 3 riders? 2 riders makes it preferable to not be main favo so you can have a helper for your leader so in end its damn near impossible for main favo to win

Which is a complete new experience. I liked it (but also I was able to win without being a favor)

There was a discussion about it here which made me change it from 4 to 2 for this year. Now it can be discussed if 3 riders would be the ideal solution. Might just need more than 1 race for people to get used to this kind of race ?

Exactly my thoughts as well. I like it more than the mostly predictable 4 riders ones last year but I didn't ride it just watched some in replay.

Elaska wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 24, 2024 8:37 pm

lennylenny wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 24, 2024 1:46 pm

could we please change the Cyclocross races to 3 riders? 2 riders makes it preferable to not be main favo so you can have a helper for your leader so in end its damn near impossible for main favo to win

Better to delete these useless races

+1

But with 2 riders its not nice, with 3 the main favo still is at disadvantage if he has to ride but not as much as with 2 because havin no helpers you pretty much can gibe up already

Have we decided to ride the Alula Tour or not?

ECS Cycling wrote: ↑

Fri Dec 27, 2024 7:01 pm

Have we decided to ride the Alula Tour or not?

I only heard people in favor so I will probably add it. But with very limited number of editions due to low category.

Final PDF to come today or tomorrow. Sorry for being late between holidays.

Final PDF online. Sorry for being so late.

- AlUla included. 2 editions, cat.1, 7 riders (in reality 6 if I got it correctly) and can improve in future years if it has a good calendar spot and becomes popular
- Fantasy race corrected
- Cyclocross left at 2 riders for now. A bit early to change it to 3. Waiting for more feedback and then change it for Feb or only next year if feedback remains mixed.

Gipfelstuermer wrote: ↑

Mon Dec 30, 2024 11:00 am

Final PDF online. Sorry for being so late.

It looks nice. However, I'm not so sure about cat 1 for a real race, as this would create a precedent. It is fine for a race like Faso where top teams are not allowed but there should be a difference between real and fantasy races in season (or we just decide not to ride fantasy tours from mid-January to mid-October). In both cases, we should allow more voices to be heard.

- last year it was 7 rides per team at AlUla (found no info about this year so far)

ECS Cycling wrote: ↑

Fri Dec 20, 2024 3:15 pm

Should be fixed now

ECS Cycling - Are these Tour down Under profiles in editor finished?
Only ask because if I look at stage 6 on official website its longer - 90km, they say 20 laps 4,5km ... (if I understand right)
Also some lap parts doesnt look like same laps in other stages ... some very short mintacts ...
And it still looks a bit raw, without place names on the route

I know there was no decision to ride it or when. The real race is on 30.01.25 but we could ride it instead of the fantasy race. It is the second edition of the race and a strong peloton is expected, as many riders are in Australia at this time anyway.

Radunion wrote: ↑

Mon Dec 30, 2024 8:21 pm

I know there was no decision to ride it or when. The real race is on 30.01.25 but we could ride it instead of the fantasy race. It is the second edition of the race and a strong peloton is expected, as many riders are in Australia at this time anyway.

Final Calendar shows Trofeo Felanitx-Ses Salines (Kat 2) at 30.01. and not a fantasy race