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Robyklebt wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 14, 2018 4:22 pm

Check for tunnels too! Some "zacken" look suspicious.

The profiles on Procyclingstats have intermediates btw. Not always fully trustworthy, but...

So now I checked it with the pdfs from the page: http://www.ltdl.my/index.php?p=race&c=index
I think their information are trustworthy.

I´m not sure if the profile is a bit adapted, but on stages 1-4 some IS are on the wrong kilometers (no big difference, only some km too early or too late).
On stage 5, the finish is HC-mountain and the Mountain Sprint is cat1, not cat4 as it currently is in the profile. And there is one IS missing on km 27.
Stage 6 has as IS on km 20 and a cat4-mountain-sprint on km 64 missing.
Stage 7 has IS on km 10, 136 and 195 missing, as well as cat-4-mountains at km 50, 63, 88 and 112.
Stage 8 has the last IS on wrong km and misses cat4-mountain on km 75 and 87.

About tunnels:
2nd stage at km 73. That´s all I could find.

And if you ask me, the mountains are all less strong than they are in real life... but the deciding GK-stage is here one for classics with only 2 x +6 in the end and the others more or less flat. The real stages is much more for mountain riders in my eyes and got +8%/9%: http://www.ltdl.my/images/manual/Stage_05.pdf

Actually my message was about Catalunya
Simply assumed Langkawi was ok (and if it wasn't who cares....)

But ok, if you say too many strange stuff, I take it out again for the moment and put in your corrections tomorrow. No time anymore today. Will then be back online tomorrow, then.

Robyklebt wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 14, 2018 6:15 pm

Actually my message was about Catalunya
Simply assumed Langkawi was ok (and if it wasn't who cares....)

But ok, if you say too many strange stuff, I take it out again for the moment and put in your corrections tomorrow. No time anymore today. Will then be back online tomorrow, then.

Ok, no problem! Just what I saw what was different from the stage-info of the tour. If somewhere is help needed, let me know

Are you serious, that tomorrow are the NC s ???

great job, when decided and planed? Yesterday?? Was not in the kalender the last days... or am i blind??

Nice...

and why during the week, a lot of teams are not able to ride i would guess

Catalunya now finished, including more IS, more cities and less tunnels! Should update automatically on my previous post.

Let me know if you find any other mistakes. I did not check 110%.


Regarding NC: Yes, during the week is not really good. Short notice is also not really good. Only thing to defend committee: If you have MSR on the weekend, you don't want NC there.

Just to be precise, PDF was clearly stating since the end of February that NC would have been today.

As everybody knows, CN must be ridden alone, so there should be no race in parallel.

The first and second weekend were taken by Nice and TIrreno, 3rd weekend Sanremo, Langkawi, 4th Catalunya and Gent Wevelgem and Langkawi.

So basically it was impossible to have it in a weekend for this month (unless we move real races but after all these CNs are pure fantasy).

Adding to this the fact that often they are buggy (hopefully doesn't seems like this today ) and so I need to be present online for good part of the day.

Robyklebt wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 14, 2018 5:01 pm

Langkawi on

Cat 1 because: seems I proposed cat 1 to Luques, who didn't object (if he even looked at the proposal) and nobody complained about it here either. Used to be cat 2 when we rode it before, but in real life participation was much better than nowadays.
7 riders because Coroncina the designer made it that way. Could change, but reality 6 it seems, so the former inofficial "Luques rule" reality +1 seems ok after all.

On question regarding the number of riders, as I talked to some other managers yesterday about it. There are two stages with more than 200km, only one shorter with about 110k and there is no rest day or TT where some can save some power. Sure that you only want to ride it with 7 riders?

only 7 riders for this tour. pff that will be a hard tour this way. With stages at 200km.
I need to look at my line up now what to do. is it not possible to ride with 8 riders. maybe we are to late but i hope it will be with 8 riders. e answer.

give them 9 riders, so that everyone can bring their full sprint train!

CircleCycle wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:21 pm

give them 9 riders, so that everyone can bring their full sprint train!

I just was checking the last year. No matter how long a tour was or which category it had, all tours had 8 riders minimum. Because with less, there won´t be balanced racing... so if also the cat1-tours with 4 stages are with 8 riders, it´s not wrong to let ride 8 riders here too.

RS Coesitz wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:26 pm

CircleCycle wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:21 pm

give them 9 riders, so that everyone can bring their full sprint train!

I just was checking the last year. No matter how long a tour was or which category it had, all tours had 8 riders minimum. Because with less, there won´t be balanced racing... so if also the cat1-tours with 4 stages are with 8 riders, it´s not wrong to let ride 8 riders here too.

And some years before some tours with 6 riders

Pokemon Club wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:28 pm

RS Coesitz wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:26 pm

CircleCycle wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:21 pm

give them 9 riders, so that everyone can bring their full sprint train!

I just was checking the last year. No matter how long a tour was or which category it had, all tours had 8 riders minimum. Because with less, there won´t be balanced racing... so if also the cat1-tours with 4 stages are with 8 riders, it´s not wrong to let ride 8 riders here too.

And some years before some tours with 6 riders

I just checked this until August 2012. There was one tour (Elk Grove in August 2012) with 6 riders. It had stages, the first one a 6 km TT, the other two short flat stages. There have been one tour (in Czech in July 2013) with 7 riders, it had 4 stages (1 short TTT and three not really hard and not long ones). I think you can´t compare this to a 8-days tour with stages more than 200 km and a mountain arrival...

I understand all reasons here but we should take into account also what's the idea of Langkawi organizers.

In real life will be 6, which makes it practically impossible to have a train and gives escape a lot of chance. This is how they organized it, this is how they wanted. When creating a tour the number of riders allowed is also a parameter taken into account by organizers to make the tour more or less difficult.

RSF will have as usual 1 more (so 7), and honestly considering that the peloton will be practically all flat - sprinters, good coop can bring good result as in the real tour.

Yes, probably won't be that easy as 9 riders, but this is what the organizers wanted and is the spirit of the tour.

luques wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:19 pm

I understand all reasons here but we should take into account also what's the idea of Langkawi organizers.

In real life will be 6, which makes it practically impossible to have a train and gives escape a lot of chance. This is how they organized it, this is how they wanted. When creating a tour the number of riders allowed is also a parameter taken into account by organizers to make the tour more or less difficult.

RSF will have as usual 1 more (so 7), and honestly considering that the peloton will be practically all flat - sprinters, good coop can bring good result as in the real tour.

Yes, probably won't be that easy as 9 riders, but this is what the organizers wanted and is the spirit of the tour.

Good argument, if you take it for every tour and not for a single one. Should have done Paris-Nice with 8 riders (7+1) then too as well as Tirreno or the Ronde de Drenthe with 7 riders (6+1). This is selective.

Just a question to Luques, in case he is online again...
Putting races online today risky, better wait for tomorrow? Or should be no problem? Don't want to create supermegabugs by having the site calculate even more in additions to the races....
If no answer I'll wait till tomorrow, better safe than sorry.

RS Coesitz wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:28 pm

luques wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:19 pm

I understand all reasons here but we should take into account also what's the idea of Langkawi organizers.

In real life will be 6, which makes it practically impossible to have a train and gives escape a lot of chance. This is how they organized it, this is how they wanted. When creating a tour the number of riders allowed is also a parameter taken into account by organizers to make the tour more or less difficult.

RSF will have as usual 1 more (so 7), and honestly considering that the peloton will be practically all flat - sprinters, good coop can bring good result as in the real tour.

Yes, probably won't be that easy as 9 riders, but this is what the organizers wanted and is the spirit of the tour.

Good argument, if you take it for every tour and not for a single one. Should have done Paris-Nice with 8 riders (7+1) then too as well as Tirreno or the Ronde de Drenthe with 7 riders (6+1). This is selective.

You have no shame to compare PN and TA with Langkawi ?

Pokemon Club wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:34 pm

You have no shame to compare PN and TA with Langkawi ?

It´s a point FOR PN and TA. If we respect the idea of the Langkawi organizers, we should DEFINETLY respect the wish of PN and TA too

RS Coesitz wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:38 pm

Pokemon Club wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:34 pm

You have no shame to compare PN and TA with Langkawi ?

It´s a point FOR PN and TA. If we respect the idea of the Langkawi organizers, we should DEFINETLY respect the wish of PN and TA too

+++

BTW Langkawi ready
you are free to play it with 7 8 9 12 riders you want.

Coroncina2 wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 5:40 pm

RS Coesitz wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:38 pm

Pokemon Club wrote: ↑

Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:34 pm

You have no shame to compare PN and TA with Langkawi ?

It´s a point FOR PN and TA. If we respect the idea of the Langkawi organizers, we should DEFINETLY respect the wish of PN and TA too

+++

BTW Langkawi ready
you are free to play it with 7 8 9 12 riders you want.

17 please. Then I can´t sign in because my team is too small

And thank you very much! One point: on stage 5, I still think on the cat-4-mountain-sprint is a cat1

Thank coro.

Will put both Catalunya and Langkawi on tomorrow, still afraid of superbugging the game doing it today. Can correct the categories myself too.

Difficulty of Cameron Highlands to me seems perfectly fine, if anything seems too hard finishing with a 5... that profile they posted is pretty impossible to read, but the way I interprete it the meters behind the % is how long it's that percentage... So right at the beginning 9,6% for 62 meters...

And of course Coesitz does have a point with +1 would mean 8 for PN etc. But the way I understand it, that was basically the rule for last year (except GTs, there it was simply the real number and lower cat races that were 8, so real number often) This year with everything going down to max 7, GTs to 8, in the end Luques after listening to the opinions in one thread which you can all search for yourselfs decided to basically keep the number 9 for GTs and cat 4 stage races, plus all one day races at cat 4 +. And everything further down not really specified. Presumably real number +1? But nothing really specified. Usually should be in the PDF.

Langkawi we didn't specify the number of riders in the PDF, my fault actually. I then assumed would be 8. Coro designs with 7, ok, I check the startlist, reality 6 riders, so 7 actually seems ok for me too. Not that I'd have any problems with 8 either (I really really don't care about Langkawi and feel I already spent at least 3 hours too much on that topic (and I haven't even spent even an hour on it). Up in this thread somewhere Luques seemed to support 7, so I'd say it's 7. If he changes his mind, then 8. And as FL in one of his (few) enlightened moments once said, the difference between 9 and 8 is bigger than between 8 and 7. Helping, The favorite with 9 can keep 4 fit (without doing helper changes acrobatics) with 8+7 it's both 3 (1 guy in tempo) Will somehow work either way.

Working on Coppi & Bartali right now.

Edit: Finished it overly motivated. Feel free to check.

Seems you haven't saved stage 1a?

Don't know how that happened... saved it again now. Hope everything else is fine.

Dear Supporters,

Would it be possible to ride this Tour in the morning hours?
Maybe at 11:00 o'clock.

Would be great.