May 2025

[Hansa]

So i interpreted Plumelec new:

https://www.procyclingstats.com/race/gp ... o/profiles

with that site coming from the D126 on the long lap we have 110 Hm on 1.8 kms -> did that with a 5 and a 6.

also the small Lap is only 8 kms long the old design had 9 kms.

And we dont ride the Cote de Cadoul from the same road so the start for the climb is different in the long and short lap.

if the new interpretation is not wanted, tell me then i only would change the first 50 kms from Gips old design but didnt feel right as the lenght didnt fit at all then with the wrong length of the small laps.

just realized my interpretation was very close to Robys old interpretation, so i compared the laps and changed some % to fit the old Laps.

Length is now 3.something kms off as the real laps are 13.7 and 7.8 kms and i used 14 and 8 km laps so thats adds up to around 3 kms

[olmania]

So i interpreted Plumelec new:

https://www.procyclingstats.com/race/gp ... o/profiles

with that site coming from the D126 on the long lap we have 110 Hm on 1.8 kms -> did that with a 5 and a 6.

also the small Lap is only 8 kms long the old design had 9 kms.

And we dont ride the Cote de Cadoul from the same road so the start for the climb is different in the long and short lap.

if the new interpretation is not wanted, tell me then i only would change the first 50 kms from Gips old design but didnt feel right as the lenght didnt fit at all then with the wrong length of the small laps.

just realized my interpretation was very close to Robys old interpretation, so i compared the laps and changed some % to fit the old Laps.

Length is now 3.something kms off as the real laps are 13.7 and 7.8 kms and i used 14 and 8 km laps so thats adds up to around 3 kms

6% makes sense somehow if you look at the climb itself cause it has a short steep part. but 5% makes sense too because of the "flatish" end to the finish line and the fact that the steep part is short.
Also that the palmares in the past years show a sprint up there (often in small groups). More chances to block a 5% than a 6% in RSF, even if blocking a 5% is still a challenge. Good thing with a 6% race is selective before final climb which is close to the reality (it's never a mass sprint with >80% of the peloton there). Bad thing with a 6%, it makes the race perfect for top climbers (and not other kind of climbers/strong classics), when in reality topclimbers dont have a shot there (as long as Pogacar don't ride it).
I'd be more for a 5% than a 6%; but that's interpretation.
Finally, I'm against a change to a 6% for now; for next year, why not ! Cause people maybe set forms according to a 5% (as I mentionned in that thread that the race would be the same. ok, they changed the start; but circuit remain the same). So, I think it's more fair to leave it to a 5% for them now. And why not discuss (early enough) changing it for next time we have Cadoudal climb in a race

Also I think that lenght for such race is a not a big issue, especially when there are many tricky circuits. if the race is a bit shorter/longer; not a big deal, especially as the impact if often at the start of the race.

[Gipfelstuermer]

- 15, 8, 5, 3, 1 points at the Redbull kms

A special individual classification by points will
be drawn up for the “Red Bull km” sprint,
awarding 15, 8, 5, 3 and 1 points to the first five
best-placed riders, respectively.

Wording is not clear to me. Does it count for ciclamino or for another classification? For now, I assume, they count for ciclamino. But if not in real life, will change it after stage 1.

[Hansa]

- 15, 8, 5, 3, 1 points at the Redbull kms

A special individual classification by points will
be drawn up for the “Red Bull km” sprint,
awarding 15, 8, 5, 3 and 1 points to the first five
best-placed riders, respectively.

Wording is not clear to me. Does it count for ciclamino or for another classification? For now, I assume, they count for ciclamino. But if not in real life, will change it after stage 1.

General Classification by points –
“Maglia Ciclamino”
At each stage finish, according to the finish
order and the stage category, the following
points will be awarded:
a and b categories (first 15 classified): 50,
35, 25, 18, 14, 12, 10, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1
c category (first 10 classified): 25, 18, 12, 8, 6,
5, 4, 3, 2, 1
d and e categories (first 10 classified): 15, 12,
9, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1
At each intermediate sprint (two per stage), the
following points will be awarded according to
the crossing order to the first 5 classified: 12, 8,
5, 3, 1.


according to the ciclamino rules it doesnt count i guess.

it for sure is another seperate classification, but i am not 100% if it counts for ciclamino too.

[Schartner Bombe]

- 15, 8, 5, 3, 1 points at the Redbull kms

A special individual classification by points will
be drawn up for the “Red Bull km” sprint,
awarding 15, 8, 5, 3 and 1 points to the first five
best-placed riders, respectively.

Wording is not clear to me. Does it count for ciclamino or for another classification? For now, I assume, they count for ciclamino. But if not in real life, will change it after stage 1.

General Classification by points –
“Maglia Ciclamino”
At each stage finish, according to the finish
order and the stage category, the following
points will be awarded:
a and b categories (first 15 classified): 50,
35, 25, 18, 14, 12, 10, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1
c category (first 10 classified): 25, 18, 12, 8, 6,
5, 4, 3, 2, 1
d and e categories (first 10 classified): 15, 12,
9, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1
At each intermediate sprint (two per stage), the
following points will be awarded according to
the crossing order to the first 5 classified: 12, 8,
5, 3, 1.


according to the ciclamino rules it doesnt count i guess.

it for sure is another seperate classification, but i am not 100% if it counts for ciclamino too.

das schreibt Eurosport:
"Red Bull Km: Bei der Italien-Rundfahrt 2025 feiert dieses Klassement seine Premiere: An diesem täglichen Zwischensprint werden (außer bei den Zeitfahren) sowohl Bonussekunden (3/2/1) als auch Punkte (12/8/6/5/4/3/2/1) für diese Sonderwertung vergeben. Der Tagessieg bringt 2500 Euro, der Gesamtsieg 15.000 Euro."
For me that means a special ranking in the race, but doe the points count also for ciclamino - because the bonussec do for GC or not?

[Gipfelstuermer]

Official News - Th, 8 May 2025

The GIRO is now open for inscription. We will race with the OFFICIAL points and boni seconds on KOM and IS. You can view them in the Race Info under 'Prizes' (after cleaning your cache). One detail: The Giro organisers still need to confirm, if only the normal Sprint (S) or also the Sprint-Boni (SB) count for the points classification (maglia ciclamino).

[Hansa]

For me that means a special ranking in the race, but doe the points count also for ciclamino - because the bonussec do for GC or not?

the bonusseconds count for GC that explicity noted in the Giro Regulations but its not mentioned they count for Ciclamino but its mentioned it gets a special own ranking

[Radunion]

There should be no ciclamino points on the special sprints.

[Hoefs Cycling Team]

That's right, but then there must be a "Red Bull KM sprints classification", like in the real giro. My proposal for c4f: keep it as it is now.

[Hoefs Cycling Team]

in my case: ciclamino with Szoboszlai was the goal today (and for this Giro) I gambled on getting points with little energy in the first intermediate sprint (because I wanted the 15 points after the first mountain), but that failed. So I let him sprint in the second intermediate sprint and he took the 12 points. I wanted to keep Szoboszlai fit for the 15 points in the third intermediate sprint. here he sprinted to 15 points: 27 points in total, as previously indicated in c4f. If this is now going to be adjusted afterwards, I want 24 points for ciclamino. Then I wouldn't have taken any risks and sprinted both first intermediate sprints and won them with certainty.

[Gipfelstuermer]

Su, 11 May 2025

Giro SB sprint points (stage 1 and all upcoming stages) have been corrected as they don't count for ciclamino. To view it correctly in the race modal, you might have to clean your cache.

[Hoefs Cycling Team]

my opinion on this: stupid that the rules are changed during the game.
If I had known this in advance, I would not have saved any energy for the SB sprint in stage 1. I did not sprint, sprint 1, in the break away: to save energy for the SB.
sprint 2 and the SB, sprint both sprints as the fastest sprinter of the leading group... now today I suddenly lost an expensive 15 points for the points jersey. Scored 27 points in stage 1. Today this has changed to 12.
If I had known this in advance, I would certainly have gotten 24 points on the first stage instead of the 12 now. it feels like 12 points have been stolen from me. It's a shame that 15 points were taken away on the day of stage 3.
We cannot copy the real Giro: there is also not something like the Red Bull classification.
This is changing rules during a game....i read the rules clearly before stage 1...now change the rules on the day of stage 3 is stupid!

[TDM_Luxembourg]

What happens with the money and points, Hoefs/Szoboslai got after stage 2 where he should not have worn it anymore?

[Hoefs Cycling Team]

are you serious TDM?
Maybe money has already been deducted from me?
you haven't made any friends with me
with this comment: why?

again: I would have simply won the first intermediate sprint if I had not had to sprint for 15 points of the Red Bull sprint
(I now left this first intermediate sprint to my fellow escapees to save energy, which otherwise would not have been necessary) and then you TDM want to punish me extra by deducting money?
TDM: don't understand you!

[Hoefs Cycling Team]

Why change things from day 1 on day 3 of the Giro?
This change should have come into effect today without correction.
Riding stage 1 again is not an option, that would be fairer than taking away points for the sprint jersey (15 in my case) two days later

[team fl]

Why change things from day 1 on day 3 of the Giro?
This change should have come into effect today without correction.
Riding stage 1 again is not an option, that would be fairer than taking away points for the sprint jersey (15 in my case) two days later

I am with Hoefs Cycling Team on this: If you race stage 1 with certain conditions, these should count, as players act accordingly in the race, as Hoefs did. If you chance the rules from stage 3 on, change it from then on. It's not like this matter much in the end anyway. There's even a word for this, that rule changes cannot affect stuff that has already happened and counted under the old rules... but you get my point I guess.

[TDM_Luxembourg]

are you serious TDM?
Maybe money has already been deducted from me?
you haven't made any friends with me
with this comment: why?

again: I would have simply won the first intermediate sprint if I had not had to sprint for 15 points of the Red Bull sprint
(I now left this first intermediate sprint to my fellow escapees to save energy, which otherwise would not have been necessary) and then you TDM want to punish me extra by deducting money?
TDM: don't understand you!

I am completely with you. In my opinion, we shouldn't suddenly change the points, but rather just let it go as we knew the rules when we rode the stage. We could make a small exception and different a little from reality. My question wasn't a hint for the admins, but simply a QUESTION.

[Gipfelstuermer]

Guys, it was written in Forum, Chat and News before stage 1.

Th, 8 May 2025

The GIRO is now open for inscription. We will race with the OFFICIAL points and boni seconds on KOM and IS. You can view them in the Race Info under 'Prizes' (after cleaning your cache). One detail: The Giro organisers still need to confirm, if only the normal Sprint (S) or also the Sprint-Boni (SB) count for the points classification (maglia ciclamino).

[Hoefs Cycling Team]

To make a final point: There are now no points at all at the SB: the real Giro does But we simply cannot match the real Giro: leaving stage 1 as it was, would have been fairer. (almost) everyone then assumed that those were the rules.
(Team Fl thanks for your comment and TDM thanks for your explains)

[Chemnitz Pro Cycling Team]

I'm also with Hoefs on this!

[Hansa]

I am not, he would not have worn ciclamino without the SB as 2+12 points is not enough to wear it on day 1.
It was clearly stated on multiple places that it would be corrected according to the Real rules for Ciclamino.

[team fl]

I am not, he would not have worn ciclamino without the SB as 2+12 points is not enough to wear it on day 1.
It was clearly stated on multiple places that it would be corrected according to the Real rules for Ciclamino.

It has not been clearly stated. This forum thread doesn't count as a) it's not an official Giro thread and b) not everybody has a forum account (yet). Anyway, this was in the official news (8 May) of the game about it, BEFORE it was clear (after stage 1)

One detail: The Giro organisers still need to confirm, if only the normal Sprint (S) or also the Sprint-Boni (SB) count for the points classification (maglia ciclamino).

We started with the initial rule that the SB, will have sprint points and counts for the Ciclamino. That was the state of being for stage 1. Then it was communicated that the SB won't give points for the ciclamino on the second day, after stage 1. Now, the admins changed the rule for the SB. So we got this (11 May):

Giro SB sprint points (stage 1 and all upcoming stages) have been corrected as they don't count for ciclamino. To view it correctly in the race modal, you might have to clean your cache.

Again: The rules during stage 1 were clear in C4F. Players acted accordingly. Nobody knew how it would be later on. Then, it was clear on day 2. But In my opinion, it is not correct to change points and money retroactive for stage 1 too. As written before, if you change a rule, you should not change the results that happened before under the old rule. So, leave the results from stage 1 as they are, also regarding points and money, and change it from strage 3. As easy as that. Nobody gets punished for riding stage 1 with the old rule.

The only argument that favoures the retroactive change of points and money is that it is now how it is intended in the Giro. But then again, it was only one stage and the impact for the real Ciclamino fight is totally neglectable most likely. You only punish players who did their best under the conditions given and now favour teams that have not. I don't think that's good.

But to finish with a positive note. In the end, this is not a huge thing anyway. But maybe these kind of things should be communicated clearer in the future. Here my draft for that news from the 8 May, so everybody could have known without a doubt:

One detail: The Giro organisers still need to confirm, if only the normal Sprint (S) or also the Sprint-Boni (SB) count for the points classification (maglia ciclamino). Depeding on the outcome, the points and money earned until then might change retroactively.

Still leaves an insecurity. But it's clear that what now happened might happen. That was not clear from the message on 8 May.

[Hoefs Cycling Team]

I like a discussion.
This was written on Thursday:
"The Giro organizers still need to confirm, if only the normal Sprint (S) or also the Sprint-Boni (SB) count for the points classification (maglia ciclamino)."
However, this is not true, the rules regarding maglia ciclamino were already known at that time. Only not with the builder of c4f.
We as players, must deal with the rules in c4f: in future just make a discicion before the start of a race, a bad discicion is better than no discicion, or half discicion, whats happend now.
I feel let down that this adjustment was not made on Friday, then you would not have had this discussion and I would have had 24 points, after stage 1 and now only 12.
The rules in cf4 should have been clear by friday, preferably sooner.
I want to leave it at this (trusted that no money will be deducted) and hope that at the end of this Giro I will not be 12 (or 15 points) short for maglia ciclimino.

Finally, to end on a positive note: I still think it is a fun game and am therefore happy with everyone's efforts to make (keep it) a fun and fair game.

[Gipfelstuermer]

Remaining one day races.


Thx OL for designing Rund um Koln



Veenendaal-Veenendaal cancelled, so I propose riding last year's version as Cat.1



Antwerp Port Epic same as last year



Circuit de Wallonie cancelled, so I propose riding last year's version as Cat.1



Marcel Kint also cancelled, so I propose riding 2023 version as Cat.1

[Hoefs Cycling Team]

Veenendaal-Veenendaal is cancelled (probably the Belgium races olso) this year because of the NAVO-top.
It's stupid that many things have to give way because of this.

When I wasn't riding the Giro, (as Dutchman) I liked to ride Veenendaal-Veenendaal. Last year's edition seems fine to me for Cf4 this year. We cannot copy exactly to the UCI calendar.