December 2022

[Gipfelstuermer]

http://www.cycling4freaks.com/radsport/ ... %20PDF.pdf

Races to be designed:
Christmas Tour

Stage Race Profiles for your information:
Hobbit
Calexico

[Robyklebt]

Just realized that IMO it's better to have the cross only twice each, not 4 editions.
Give a choice, "normal race" and short cross. Most likely I won't ride anything (on holiday) but if I was home and playing every day as usual, my first choice would be a normal race, second cross, third Christmas Tour...But possibly Christmas Tour before being forced to ride 3 short races instead....
I assume I'm not the only one that doesn't really want to ride a tour but doesn't want to get 3 short races in that time either.

Pro 2 editions only! Opinions?

[lennylenny]

I will probably ride the Christmas Tour.
But i usually prefer short races.
Also what gets alternatives and what doesn't? ITT and TTT alternatives i understand because the only thing that really matters there is TT stat with no money on the road or a chance of a group winning.
Now you ask for an alternative for short races.
Next someone asks for alternatives for long races.
Then someone asks for alternatives for Pave races. (I wouldn't be opposed to that)
Then someone asks for alternatives for mountain races.
Then someone asks for alternatives for flat races.
Then someone asks for alternatives for hilly races.
So where does it stop and why? Or do we use 2+ one-day races every day? I don't think we have enough designs for that

[Robyklebt]

It was done like that season.

And I actually didn't ask for an alternative for short races. I asked for an alternative for cross races. Like it was done last year.

[Gipfelstuermer]

Like it was done last year.

That was a test of the race type. Participation in cross was better than in the parallel one day race. So I suggest to increase from 2 to 4 editions. Lenny's point is also correct. Even for ITT and TTT I wouldn't mind having them stand alone from time to time.

[Robyklebt]

Well, if everybody wants that...

Oh, we care what people want? Let's see then, from the offseason thread.
Gipfel's proposal (where nothing is mentioned of having ONLY these races on that day and it's even mentioned that it's not representative) and the reactions.

2) Cyclocross
We tried it last year with a parallel race every day. Well, there was usually a parallel tour on top and we had extremely low numbers back then, so very much not representative, I guess... Anyway, the cyclocross races had 3.1 teams per edition and the parallel races had 2.9 teams per edition.

We had 10 cyclocross races in total in Dec, Jan & Feb. We can do the same again (now even easier, because mostly these races don't need a new design). The calendar would be the following:

ad 2.) You're pretty obsessed with cyclocross. Do we really need that? We still have the C4F classics as interesting one day races. I am perfectly happy with just "normal" races. But if you insist (and last offseason, it was a thing somehow), then leave it at max. 1-2 cyclocross races a month at least, in my opinion.

2) No we don't need it. To answer FLs question. But on the other hand it doesn't hurt anybody either. So same deal as last year seems ok for me, like TTs and TTTs nowadays, get's half the editions of the 1 day races. (If we ever manage to get up to 5 1 day races a day again would keep it at 2) Nothing really speaks against having them again (and nothing really for it, I'm fully in the who cares camp on that one) So sometimes I'll have that as only option to ride, so I ride it, no problem. If I remember correctly there was some criticism on number of riders? Or other stuff? Up to the designer (Gipfel) to change or not change that. Or maybe I remember wrong anyway.

2) Not a big fan, the races are too fast for me

2) I don't need Cyclocross tbh.

To me that looks like we won't have any Cyclocross races actually....
Or we could do the sensible thing and have 2 editions per day. Instead of trying to push through something that clearly isn't all that universally beloved.

[flockmastoR]

Well. Gip argued with the number of participants in relation to other stuff. Not overwhelming but a point for them. I found the designs interesting. In fact I was not able to ride them. I would vote for leaving them in the way they where handled last year.

[Hansa]

i dont really like the cyclocross races but i dont mind them. but having sth parallel is nice.

[Pokemon Club]

I don't like too. I prefer to have fantasy pave or fantasy dirty road race instead of 30/45 km race

[rsv flaschbier]

I don't like too. I prefer to have fantasy pave or fantasy dirty road race instead of 30/45 km race

Same here

[flockmastoR]

Stage 6 of Calexico got updated (ymin negative to have a better looking profile)

[Robyklebt]

We need somebody to design the Christmas Tour. Any volunteers?

[schappy]

I can do it, if nobody wants. It have to be ready in the next days for the "form" i mean.

If it is okay, i make a tour for all kind of rider types.

[Robyklebt]

Go for it, since nobody else seems eager!

For all types is how it should be, good. Usually has some sort of Christmas theme, but up to the designer really.

[schappy]

Christmas Tour in Israel. Some historical (more religion) places to visit here.

4 Stages types normally:
1 flat for Sprinter
1 Classics against Sprinter
1 Classics against Climber
1 for Climber

Stage 1 178 KM, mintact 158, hilly
We starting in Jericho, the City next to the religion place, where Jesus was christened in the Jordan from his Cousin. (Only stuff from the holy Bible).
We ride near the Dead Sea and ends in the larger City Be'er Sheva in the south Israel.


Last two Hills:
First Hill 24 KM with 3,9%,
8,7,5,7,6,6,3,1,3,4,3,2,3,3,2,2,3,-2,3,2,7,6,6,3

Second Hill 9 KM with 3,5%
3,5,-3,3,1,4,8,5,5

Stage 2 144 KM, mintact 130, flat
No interesting Places here. From the south to the coast to the Big City Tel Aviv.



Stage 3 186 KM, mintact 176, hilly
We start at the Coast straight to the north to Haifa. We get here the "city hill" Mount Carmel (7,8,8,2,-7,1,4,8,7). Ride through the original Bethlehem in Galilee and ride to the Galilee Sea and go Back to Nazareth the Birthplace from Joseph.


Hill near Kfar Kama 4 KM with 7%
7,9,8,4

Last 8 KM are 2,0,1,1,10,4,7,0,3


Stage 4 172 KM, mintact 146, hilly
A holy ride from Nazareth, to the Jordan, and to Jerusalem and end in Bethlehem. With to last hills and an hilly end.


First Hill 11 KM with 4,6%
3,4,6,3,5,6,6,6,4,3,5,4

Last Hill 13 KM with 4,5%
3,2,2,3,2,4,9,9,6,5,2,5,6

last KM after the French Hill
-2,-5,-5,0,1,8,6,-6,-1,-4,-2,3,5,0,0,-3

[Robyklebt]

Finalized, first races online, check for mistakes as usual.

[Robyklebt]

All the stuff that comes on before the month change should be on, but always better check if nothing was forgotten, wrong category or stuff like that.

[Robyklebt]

Remaining fantasy races for dec on. Moved to Oceania next.

In an attack of idiocy put a race in New Zealand as Australia, not going to correct it with the buggy tool, but maybe Alkstuermer want/can change it by hand... if not we'll survive it.

Check for mistakes as usual, or even more since I'm on holiday and not fully concentrated.